Feminism Discussion Thread

[radical6]

it sucks that you are dysphoric, but ripping off your breasts is not the answer. some people want to rip off their limbs, but doctors do not actually let them amputate their limbs because that's just not the right solution. i don't know how you feel, but i sympathize with you like i sympathize with other people who have medical conditions.

Shut the hell up.

You know nothing about me. You know nothing about my body. You know nothing about my trauma. I am sex repulsed. I am dysphoric. I do not feel like this body is mine. I do not like this body. My body has only gotten me sexually abused as well.

Do not act like you know me. Do not act like you're smart.

Do not tell me you understand how I feel. You are not me. You have never faced what I faced. Do not sympathize with me. I do not want your fake pity.

GENDER IS LITERALLY BODY PARTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! it should only be used for medical stuff, and people of both genders should be treated the exact same (no male/female marketing). interests are a part of people's PERSONALITIES, not their genders. that is like saying only people with blond hair can like cats, and anyone else who likes cats must be transblond. both exist, but they are 100% unrelated.

Oh my god...

violence against trans people (or anyone else) is never justified. i am saying that i do not agree with people identifying as trans, not that i want to kill them.

You do agree with violence against trans people. Denying their identity is an act of violence. Denying trans women safety is an act of violence.

This is what your group of stupid feminists seek out.

This is what your group of feminists do.

There have been TERFs who have actively campaigned for laws to be passed to make it harder for trans people to transistion. To pass. To even see a doctor.

TERFs out trans TEENAGERS. TEENAGERS. to their PARENTS. TELL ME HOW THAT IS OKAY? Tell me how thats not what your awful terf feminism does?

Your feminism ruins trans womens lives. Your feminism gets them killed. Your feminism does nothing. I hate it. It's funny to me, because most TERFs are cis white women. And, they have never experienced sexual abuse in their life usually. It's hilarious to me. Really. How they think they face the hardest **** in their life.

Your stupid concerns are useless. You want to deny trans women from women spaces because you think trans women will rape cis women.

Guess what?

They don't. They never had.

There is no reason to deny them. But yet, you will probably allow trans men into women spaces. How funny.

You know why I hate people like you so much? Because it's your thinking that gets trans women killed. I worry so much for my friend. She is only a child, but the whole world already wants her dead.

People like you want to make it harder for her to live her life. She is a child. She has known she was a girl ever since she could walk. Yet, you say she's not a woman. That she hasn't grown up living as a girl.

Do you know how often I think of her safety? I wish no harm ever comes to her. She is so young. She is so innocent. She's done nothing wrong.

But I know she will face harm one day, and I cannot stop it. Because it's a daily thing for trans women in their life.

So just ****ing stop it with this toxic attitude. You want to kick trans women out of the very spaces they need most.

 

[Tao]

society is male dominated and oriented women are considered a minority so yeah that pretty much speaks for itself p. sure women have it worse no matter how much it hurts ur feelings lmao

Women in a lot of countries are treated like second rate citizens like do some research before claiming women DONT "have it harder"

I don't think anybody is saying that women don't have it harder, only that a lot of people seem to invalidate sexism towards men almost entirely by saying "but women have it harder" in a "so deal with it" sort of way, kind of like you keep continuously doing.


You can also bring up other countries as much as you want, it doesn't change the fact that males are negatively effected from sexism as well and that it's just as important as sexism against females. Why is it just as important? Because of equality. It doesn't matter if they "have it harder" or not.

 

[Kildor]

I don't like calling myself a feminist, though I do call myself an egalitarian. Where I believe that all men and women are equal.
I'm alright with feminism though, I just think that radical feminists ruin everything that the first-wave feminists fought for.

 

[kayleee]

Okay but public service announcement all of the males in this thread have come in and been like "but males face ridicule too!!!!!1111" like um yeah but you're doing exactly what you say women do when men's issues are brought up like talk about ironic.... It's exactly like what princess said with people screaming ALL LIVES MATTER when someone says black lives matter.... Like yes we get that but right now we are talking about black lives.... In this case I was talking about women you don't need to get your panties in a bunch making sure I acknowledge men's struggles too like chill lmao

 

[RhinoK]

Okay but public service announcement all of the males in this thread have come in and been like "but males face ridicule too!!!!!1111" like um yeah but you're doing exactly what you say women do when men's issues are brought up like talk about ironic.... It's exactly like what princess said with people screaming ALL LIVES MATTER when someone says black lives matter.... Like yes we get that but right now we are talking about black lives.... In this case I was talking about women you don't need to get your panties in a bunch making sure I acknowledge men's struggles too like chill lmao

Nice reply to Tao,,,, did they hurt ur feelings lmao?????
ALSO don't call me male.... it's pretty oppressive... you wouldn't call women females would u??

I don't think anybody is saying that women don't have it harder, only that a lot of people seem to invalidate sexism towards men almost entirely by saying "but women have it harder" in a "so deal with it" sort of way, kind of like you keep continuously doing.


You can also bring up other countries as much as you want, it doesn't change the fact that males are negatively effected from sexism as well and that it's just as important as sexism against females. Why is it just as important? Because of equality. It doesn't matter if they "have it harder" or not.

drag her Tao <3

 

[kayleee]

Nice reply to Tao,,,, did they hurt ur feelings lmao?????



drag her Tao <3

Are you like 13

Also that was the worst "drag" I've ever encountered LMAO you guys are hilarious. Men are stupid

 

[Tao]

Okay but public service announcement all of the males in this thread have come in and been like "but males face ridicule too!!!!!1111" like um yeah but you're doing exactly what you say women do when men's issues are brought up like talk about ironic.... It's exactly like what princess said with people screaming ALL LIVES MATTER when someone says black lives matter.... Like yes we get that but right now we are talking about black lives.... In this case I was talking about women you don't need to get your panties in a bunch making sure I acknowledge men's struggles too like chill lmao

Actually, I only specifically mentioned 'male struggles' in the first place because of certain comments by certain people implying that certain things happen or only apply to women when they don't.

I'm not really " doing exactly what you say women do when men's issues are brought up" at all since I'm not trying to make any issues seem insignificant or none existent compared to others. I'm defending that some issues exist in the first place when people like yourself are implying that they don't.

 

[Ashtot]

Men are stupid

And that's why Feminism has a bad reputation...

 

[RhinoK]

And that's why Feminism has a bad reputation...

That's why? That's like the most tame thing Kayleee has said

 

[Ashtot]

That's why? That's like the most tame thing Kayleee has said

It's the blatant statements like this that turn people off from it and make people frustrated.

 

[RhinoK]

It's the blatant statements like this that turn people off from it and make people frustrated.

True. but Kayleee has been very hostile and condescending which is enough to put people off feminism

 

[Watchingthetreetops]

I'm a bit...strange on this subject. I don't believe in the....give me this because I am special mentality of a lot of groups these days. For example, the new Ghostbusters movie sort of makes me sick. They're treating the fact that their cast is female as a gimmick, which makes me skeptical. Treating...being a woman as a trick to get people to watch your movie sort of defeats the point of writing about female characters. It isn't about...make things female. It's about: write females as characters. We are not 'females' we are 'human', therefore having something say: LOOK WE HAVE FEMALES makes my stomach sick. I don't want it as a gimmick, I want to be treated like my life is worth more then having babies and making families. I am not the female love interest in my life, I am the main character and there is more to me then my uterus.

I much prefer aligning myself with the 'he for she' movement, because there is a lot less negativity surrounding it. I will not blame men for the bad things that have happened to me, as I have made bad choices that involved men. And men have made bad choices that involve me. It isn't about being a woman or a man, it is about accepting that I am a female and I have male tendencies and this is all perfectly natural and okay, and He for She preaches not only this, but that men have female tenancies and that's okay, too. NO ONE is here to be the property of someone else. I am not meant to be someone else's side kick and that's it. I am here to be me and I could care absolutely less what you have to think about it. If you think that being a woman somehow makes me less, go ahead and tell me. I'm glad to remind anyone of how insignificant you and and all of your opinions are when compared to the universe. When compared to the vastness of the universe, you and I are nothing more then arguing specs of dust. So go ahead. Tell me how much better you are then me.

We are truly dancers on the same plane of existence and I will gladly do battle with you.

- - - Post Merge - - -

-------------

As is said above, statements like 'men are stupid' really /are/ why I don't like saying I'm a feminist. When I /do/ say it, I feel like I have to be careful, because it's things like that that make feminism a derogatory term now a days. Now, we had to fight to vote. We are fighting to be treated like humans. Women are not here to be the trophy for men. And that....that's really where I stand. And I really think it's important to recognize that things really /are/ changing. Women are not being seen like they were, before. I think...ug... people are feeling WAY too entitled. 'Give me special things because I am a special snowflake'. That's the mentality I see and it...just....grosses me out. I despise talking about it because people get offended so quickly, but you don't deserve anything special. If you want something special, go make it and be proud that you did, because if a meteor the size of mars plummets through the earth, you and your special qualities will not save you.

disclaimer: I mean no offense to anyone

 

[piichinu]

I don't think anybody is saying that women don't have it harder, only that a lot of people seem to invalidate sexism towards men almost entirely by saying "but women have it harder" in a "so deal with it" sort of way, kind of like you keep continuously doing.


You can also bring up other countries as much as you want, it doesn't change the fact that males are negatively effected from sexism as well and that it's just as important as sexism against females. Why is it just as important? Because of equality. It doesn't matter if they "have it harder" or not.

You're trying to equate the struggles of men and women to be equal
No they aren't
Men have issues too. The point is,
Yes men's issues in society are important! But overall, men dominate in society, which is why before solving their issues, we need women to be treated as equals. There's never been a time when men were viewed as inferior to women in a GENERAL way. And that's the whole point in feminism, but you people come into this thread, and as soon as someone says something about double standards or anything, you jump to "it happens to men too" (please see: ALL LIVES MATTER)
Alright sure let's say it does. But like I said before
"overall, men dominate in society, which is why before solving their issues, we need women to be treated as equals. There's never been a time when men were viewed as inferior to women in a GENERAL way."

And Im pretty sure kaylee only said that because people are being annoying as ***.

 

[RhinoK]

You're behaving in the same way loool. Double standards again

Double standards? I know I'm being annoying, I didn't say I wasn't, but I'm not being so condescending as Kayleee is

 

[Ashtot]

I think that's the thing about Feminism though. A lot of people simply want equal rights, instead of simply making women's rights equal to that of a mans, if that makes sense. I think that's the difference between Egalitarianism and Feminism.

 

[pillow bunny]

Shut the hell up.

You know nothing about me. You know nothing about my body. You know nothing about my trauma. I am sex repulsed. I am dysphoric. I do not feel like this body is mine. I do not like this body. My body has only gotten me sexually abused as well.

Do not act like you know me. Do not act like you're smart.

Do not tell me you understand how I feel. You are not me. You have never faced what I faced. Do not sympathize with me. I do not want your fake pity.

i'm pretty sure this is meant to be a super cool shutdown post and force me into exile due to shame. but so far, you have not actually responded to any of my posts. you have just being calling me an idiot and a 13 year old. the whole trans thing makes no sense to me, but instead of trying to explain it you've just been insulting me.

1. what is gender and what is the criteria for identifying as each gender?
2. why is it a better solution to reinforce gender instead of abolishing gender roles?
3. if gender is not necessarily tied to biological sex, why must people change their sex to match their gender?

Oh my god...

"oh my god" is not a response

i literally do not understand how my example is different from yours. you're acting like i understand transgender logic and am trying to troll you or something, when i legitimately don't. calling me stupid and violent is not going to change my mind (unless you just want a bunch of fake allies who align themselves with whatever is popular on tumblr, which i think you might?)

You do agree with violence against trans people. Denying their identity is an act of violence. Denying trans women safety is an act of violence.

This is what your group of stupid feminists seek out.

This is what your group of feminists do.

There have been TERFs who have actively campaigned for laws to be passed to make it harder for trans people to transistion. To pass. To even see a doctor.

TERFs out trans TEENAGERS. TEENAGERS. to their PARENTS. TELL ME HOW THAT IS OKAY? Tell me how thats not what your awful terf feminism does?

Your feminism ruins trans womens lives. Your feminism gets them killed. Your feminism does nothing. I hate it. It's funny to me, because most TERFs are cis white women. And, they have never experienced sexual abuse in their life usually. It's hilarious to me. Really. How they think they face the hardest **** in their life.

Your stupid concerns are useless. You want to deny trans women from women spaces because you think trans women will rape cis women.

Guess what?

They don't. They never had.

There is no reason to deny them. But yet, you will probably allow trans men into women spaces. How funny.

You know why I hate people like you so much? Because it's your thinking that gets trans women killed. I worry so much for my friend. She is only a child, but the whole world already wants her dead.

People like you want to make it harder for her to live her life. She is a child. She has known she was a girl ever since she could walk. Yet, you say she's not a woman. That she hasn't grown up living as a girl.

Do you know how often I think of her safety? I wish no harm ever comes to her. She is so young. She is so innocent. She's done nothing wrong.

But I know she will face harm one day, and I cannot stop it. Because it's a daily thing for trans women in their life.

So just ****ing stop it with this toxic attitude. You want to kick trans women out of the very spaces they need most.

why can someone "just know" they are transgender, but not transracial or anything else? the logic behind them is EXACTLY the same. it used to be believed that black and white people had different brains. i will continue to hold this view until someone explains how "girl" can be a state of mental being.

as i have said multiple times, male and female BATHROOMS and CHANGEROOMS (also some sports) should be segregated based on biological sex because they have different body parts. NO OTHER PLACES should be separate. if a transwoman is really a woman, she will express that in all other aspects of her life. having to use a toilet on the left side of the hallway instead of the right should not be the issue that makes or breaks her identity, because that is literally saying woman=female man=male, which as far as i know is the opposite of what you believe

can a nazi run around killing people, and then say they are the victim because "americans want to imprison us" and "nazis are literally being murdered for their beliefs"? yes, that was a terrible example and no, i don't believe trans people are worse than nazis or anything. but if i had never heard of a nazi and that was all people told me when i asked what they were, how would i know the difference? you have provided reasons why TERFs are evil (actually only one reason, but i digress) but have not seen a reason to believe in trans people's identities other than "but TERFs are mean!"

i mean, your entire post was just you restating "it's mean to be mean1!" in a bunch of different ways. were you actually trying to convince me of something or not?

i assume you're a liberal based on your posts. since liberals are "mean" to conservatives, should we all become conservatives instead without taking a second to look at each side's beliefs?

 

[Watchingthetreetops]

I would just like to point out: men have always had the right to vote. Women had to fight for that. Men have always been paid more then women, despite women doing the same work.

There is a reason feminism exists, and women are not treated as equally as men. Men have issues, but in areas where things like equality have little to no meaning, men are dominating and degrading women. I moved from Iowa to Texas...and let me tell you, working in retail here is...is like working with EXACTLY the type of men that women fear. The type of men who want us in the kitchen, doing nothing more then cooking and having babies. Or at least, that's what my job is like. They cringe at the thought of a strong woman and demean women constantly. I mean...men have issues too, but they are dominant therefore they are able to get away with more. When a woman stands and tries to be strong there is army of both men and women ready to aim and fire at her, because a)eeeew, feminism, I bet she's an extremist and b)EVEN OTHER WOMEN ARE AFRAID TO STAND ON THEIR OWN BECAUSE THEY'VE BEEN TAUGHT TO PLEASE MEN AND ONLY MEN AND DEMEAN WOMEN FOR STANDING AGAINST THAT.

*ahem* I'm sorry. I can't stop ranting this morning.

 

[Ashtot]

You're mainly just throwing out a lot of generalizations.

Not all men are dominant over women.

Not all men are twisted to think that women are objects or that they belong in the kitchen.

Not all women believe that their supposed to be submissive and please men.

I understand that these are your experiences but you can't simply pin it on everyone. It insults both women and men.

 

[RhinoK]

Men have always been paid more then women, despite women doing the same work.

The wage gap is a myth today in places like the USA and UK.

 

[Oblivia]

Hey guys. Just another reminder to please refrain from making personal attacks or hurling insults at one another. It's fine to have a different viewpoint and equally fine to explain why you feel a certain way, but there's no need to name call or be rude even if someone feels differently than you about a certain subject. Being passionate about something is great and that's why I'm inclined to leave this thread open (for now) as it is generating some great discussion, but please remember to respect one another in your posts, and take it to PMs if you MUST argue.

I understand that it's frustrating when someone just won't see your point of view no matter how hard you try to drive it into their brains, but in these situations it's normally best to just agree to disagree and walk away.