So make it clearly against the rules and apply the rule to everyone. There is already such content on the forum. I'm only suggesting to make it clear exactly what can/cannot be discussed.
Under prohibited content, it specifies pornography, nudity, and sexual materials.
Perhaps it should be changed to sexual content and then further clarified?
And those posts were apologized for and explained. Of course there is no need. But there is more such content on the forum. I'm just saying, clarify the rules, decide where the line is, make it clear, and move forward.
So make it clearly against the rules and apply the rule to everyone. There is already such content on the forum. I'm only suggesting to make it clear exactly what can/cannot be discussed.
Under prohibited content, it specifies pornography, nudity, and sexual materials.
Perhaps it should be changed to sexual content and then further clarified?
And those posts were apologized for and explained. Of course there is no need. But there is more such content on the forum. I'm just saying, clarify the rules, decide where the line is, make it clear, and move forward.
Under prohibited content, it specifies pornography, nudity, and sexual materials.
Perhaps it should be changed to sexual content and then further clarified?
I don't believe we've ever spoken before. The posts you've made in this thread are my first impression of you and I'm finding this particular take really troubling.
I don't believe we've ever spoken before. The posts you've made in this thread are my first impression of you and I'm finding this particular take really troubling.
Age gaps are a source of conflict and controversy for a reason. The age of consent varies from place to place but even that is problematic, in my opinion.
To wave away real cries of concern because, "it's legal," is disregarding the harm that can still take place.
If I'm not personally in a relationship, i cannot make any judgements about that relationship. It would ne unfair to make any assumptions, good or bad, about any relationships in which I am not directly involved.
If you want a forum rule wherein age gap relationships should not be discussed because some view them negatively, suggest it as a rule, and apply it moving forward. Simple.
To say that they would be on equal footing with an adult who has likely been in the workforce for years, lived alone for years, had more experience dating in adult scenarios (ie: not having to abide by a parental curfew) is, quite frankly, ignorant.
It's troubling for a staff member (a senior one at that) to vocalize these relationships because he is in a position of power. There are children on this site, teenagers, and young adults.
So if you think there should be a rule against discussing age gap relationships because there are children on this site and it could be harmful, I'll say it again, go ahead and suggest it. Apply it to everyone moving forward. Seems quite simple to me.
If I'm not personally in a relationship, i cannot make any judgements about that relationship. It would ne unfair to make any assumptions, good or bad, about any relationships in which I am not directly involved.
And those posts were apologized for and explained. Of course there is no need. But there is more such content on the forum. I'm just saying, clarify the rules, decide where the line is, make it clear, and move forward.
I think we can agree on “clarify the rules, decide where the line is.” For those of us who are suggesting that Chris be deplatformed, part of “drawing the line” means staff taking accountability by way of demonstrating consequences for one of their own who like, very clearly crossed it, did so repeatedly, and went on to cause harm to the community in a completely different context (notice that I don’t at all think the valentine’s situation was about me).
So, if I may speak for the ~collective~ I’d like to point out, furthermore, that the lot of us see consequences as a neutral thing?
It’s not like “hey, we fundamentally hate you and you should leave,” it’s “sorry that you’re facing these developmental challenges, I hope that relieving you of your responsibility to a large and diverse community helps you focus on yourself.”
I’m not posting here to argue about what whatever Chris did/didn’t do. But I share Selky’s recent sentiments that more or less boils it down to, ‘sure, this conversation is nuanced, but no matter what, what you posted was inappropriate for an animal crossing forum and unbecoming of a moderator, period.’
If I'm not personally in a relationship, i cannot make any judgements about that relationship. It would ne unfair to make any assumptions, good or bad, about any relationships in which I am not directly involved.
If you want a forum rule wherein age gap relationships should not be discussed because some view them negatively, suggest it as a rule, and apply it moving forward. Simple.
Why? Because it feels as though you are being deliberately obtuse while also somehow managing to come across as condescending. You are dismissing people's genuine concerns in such a frivolous manner that it makes me feel sick to my stomach reading your responses.
I am absolutely dumbfounded by that reaction. That sort of mentality is exactly how people end up stuck in abusive and unsafe relationships. Because people close their eyes and say, "it's not my business!".
It's not that I want a forum rule inwhich age gaps shouldn't be discussed. It's that *a staff member never should have been discussing such age gaps in a positive light in the first place.*
You may not know everyone's life experiences or history but as you get to know people you are able to make judgements. Circling back to the above it's doing that sort of thing that allows you to see when a relationship may be troubling.
There is no amount of life experience that an 18 year old can have that makes them a suitable partner for a 28 year old. I am somebody who people would consider as having, "a lot of life experience,". I've lived the type of life that many would say would require me to, "grow up fast", to endure. Childhood abuse, homelessness as a preteen, I have a disabled and divorced single parent that absolutely stuck me into a coparenting cargiving role much too early.
In no way shape or form would it have been healthy for me to date somebody 10 years my senior despite being "mature for my age" or however immature the other party may be.
because nobody has all the information at all times, not even those in the relationship directly
saying 'I don't know everything, so I won't say anything' isn't fair or honorable. it's moral cowardice that only serves to embolden the problem parts/people at the expense of those negatively affected
When people are specific, you take one piece of their post and go with it in an entirely opposite direction. Your take from everything was no one wants age gap to be discussed which was not the topic whatsoever. However, it's pointless in arguing with you because it seems purposeful on your end and borderline trolling.
Your posts do actual more harm for the stance you're trying to protect than if you actually read what people are posting and asking for.
you don't need to be directly in a relationship to see that it's harmful. if a 16, 17, or yes in many cases even 18 year old is in a relationship with a 40 year old, that's inappropriate. if someone is physically or emotionally abusive to their partner, that's harmful. if the loved ones of a young teenager or victim of an abusive relationship are aware of the relationship, they don't need to be part of it to see that it's wrong, and the victim should be supported.
I hope it goes without saying that I'm not accusing any member of the staff or anyone else of being in such a dynamic, but I find the take that you can't judge a relationship you're not in yourself to be incredibly harmful and should not be platformed on a website like this. young people go through their childhoods and young adulthoods learning what healthy relationships are meant to look like, and it's up to adults to make sure they know what is and isn't appropriate.
If i may speak for most of those who are privately msg me, most believe that Chris is being treated unfairly by some members in this thread and do not see things as some in this thread see things.
To be specific: 'I like Chris. I feel so bad for Chris. People are being so mean to Chris. Why not just make new rules and move on. If they drive Chris out, I'm not staying. Here are some collectible/tbt, this is ugly and ridiculous' - are some of what i get from people.
They are not speaking up publicly because they do not want to be on the receiving end of some of the negative behavior displayed in this thread.
So I'm just trying to make people aware that not everyone feels the same way. Plenty of people support Chris staying and moving forward with new rules. I get a lot more, but that's the important, common point.
I think if everyone who disagrees on that point can agree on what they'd like to see regarding rules moving forward, it might help?
Whatever staff decides, i do hope they clarify rules on content.
but I find the take that you can't judge a relationship you're not in yourself to be incredibly harmful and should not be platformed on a website like this.
The subject was dynanics of age gap relationships. Nobody mentioned any other factors. So imo, going by just the age gap dynamic, if I'm not involved, i can't judge.
Why change the subject to be all of those other things? This was specifically about age gap dynamics.
The subject was dynanics of age gap relationships. Nobody mentioned any other factors. So imo, going by just the age gap dynamic, if I'm not involved, i can't judge.
Why change the subject to be all of those other things? This was specifically about age gap dynamics.
If I'm not personally in a relationship, i cannot make any judgements about that relationship. It would ne unfair to make any assumptions, good or bad, about any relationships in which I am not directly involved.
that reads to me like you were speaking in a general sense. if that isn't the case I apologize, but the point still stands even if we're only talking about age gap relationships. a teenager being with a much older adult is a dynamic that should very much be judged for the reasons that lumi has already stated.
No I'm not. I'm trying to stick to the point.
Point one - people shouldn't misrep posts and mischaracterize others.
Point two - it was suggested that Chris discussing age gap relationships was harmful. My response - if it's harmful, make a rule against it.
I am absolutely dumbfounded by that reaction. That sort of mentality is exactly how people end up stuck in abusive and unsafe relationships. Because people close their eyes and say, "it's not my business!".
It's not that I want a forum rule inwhich age gaps shouldn't be discussed. It's that *a staff member never should have been discussing such age gaps in a positive light in the first place.*
If a staff member cannot discuss such age gaps in a positive light because ot is harmful, then forum members shouldn't either imo. So, make a rule. Figure out where the line should be drawn and make a rule.
No I'm not. I'm trying to stick to the point.
Point one - people shouldn't misrep posts and mischaracterize others.
Point two - it was suggested that Chris discussing age gap relationships was harmful. My response - if it's harmful, make a rule against it.
No, you are. I have read your replies. I have seen how you've spoken to people. You can hide behind the excuse of, "I'm trying to stick to the point," but in doing so you are dismissing and invalidating peoples experiences and feelings.
I apologize. I did not realize I had to explain that the issue with age gap relationships (specifically in the ranges I am focusing on) is that they are unsafe. They often lead to abuse. Whether that be physical abuse, mental abuse, verbal abuse, financial abuse. The power dynamic in such a relationship is skewed to favour the older party. That is the whole issue I take with them. It's not that I find them, "icky" it's that they are unsafe.
If a staff member cannot discuss such age gaps in a positive light because ot is harmful, then forum members shouldn't either imo. So, make a rule. Figure out where the line should be drawn and make a rule.
If a staff member cannot discuss such age gaps in a positive light because ot is harmful, then forum members shouldn't either imo. So, make a rule. Figure out where the line should be drawn and make a rule.
Yes, it is harmful! So, why stop at just
~making the rule~ when a significant amount of people were already made to rightfully distrust the fitness of this staff member? And, who is saying regular members should be able to? I think this is what people mean by saying you are twisting points in your responses. It has the effect of being made to feel unreasonable for things that are actually quite reasonable. That, to me, is “negative behavior.”
that reads to me like you were speaking in a general sense. if that isn't the case I apologize, but the point still stands even if we're only talking about age gap relationships. a teenager being with a much older adult is a dynamic that should very much be judged for the reasons that lumi has already stated.
The topic was specific to age gap relationships, not relationships in general. I'm trying to stick to the topic. I would definitely have different takes on different topics.
I don't agree on your second point, though. If the only information i have is that there is an age gap, no way would i ever presume to judge that relationship.
My parents had a very significant age gap when they were married. They had a happy, successful marriage for 50+ years until my dad passed away. My mother was 100% the power in that couple.
I find it sad that people might have seen the age gap and judged them negatively solely for that reason, without knowing anything about their dynamics as a couple.
And if people in this forum think that being in an age gap relationship will be seen in a negative light, solely for the age gap, I think that would be sad also.
with all due respect, given the negative effect chris' actions have had on people, to say nothing of various other problem instances with the site that staff have repeatedly chosen to ignore, the opinions of those choosing to opine privately about someone being called out on his bs and threatening to leave if he is justifiably removed from power mean less than dirt to me. if they prefer happy fun times over power being held to account, than that shows me exactly the type of people they are, and I'll hazard a guess that the real reason none of them will speak up is because they know their stance is indefensible. if any of them have a problem, then they need to speak up about it. willingly choosing to vacate one's seat at tbe table just because it's easier isn't an excuse. if they can't bother to do that bare minimum form of engagement, then they have no grounds to complain
I apologize. I did not realize I had to explain that the issue with age gap relationships (specifically in the ranges I am focusing on) is that they are unsafe.
idk what to say. welcome to the real world, I guess?
sometimes people will disagree with you, but you just have to suck it up, if you believe in your stance, and push forward. nobody ever changed anything, for better or worse, by sitting on the sidelines because 'I don't want to deal with the negativity'
