Do you have a faith?

[Megamannt125]

What if you're wrong and you're an atheist? :O

If I am wrong and there is a god, I don't want to worship him. Why?
Because either A. He's just some cosmic energy in space that doesn't even know we exist
or B. He watches over us, yet doesn't do anything about starving children, war, and disease just because the first two humans made a mistake.

First of all, @Moonlight: I see now. Instead, I'm contesting Carl Sagan.

Megaman: Come now, you're smarter than that. Humans need to be advocates for themselves. Why? We would never *censored.3.0*ing learn anything if any sort of God simply solved all of our problems. We need to eliminate war, hunger, and disease by ourselves. We simply cannot allow whatever God there exists to magically solve all of the afformentioned problems, and any more you can come up with!

I know, humans in general are the cause for all the worlds problems, my point is that, what's the point of worshipping this god if he's not doing anything? If that's the case, then it seems to me like all he did was create the universe, told humans stuff for a few years, then just sat back and watched.

 

[Josh]

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

The thing is, God will forgive you. Religious or not he will. Some people do bad things and don't give a damn on what they just did like taking somebody's lives from them or completely ruining it.
Even atheist can go into heaven (I'm sure) if you're just good overall.

Not according to Christian Bible. You have to bow down, believe, and have faith (which is a really trivial thing if you think about it.) That should raise an immediate red flag. Why would an all knowing God want to be worshiped or believed in? Is he an ego maniac or something?

Yes! God is an ego maniac! I can tell you myself, it says it in the Old Testament and New Testament.

However, humans should not expect to be treated fairly by God if they do not believe in God. You can't expect a priest to feed you one of those communion wafers if you're not a practicing Catholic, for example.

^Something what I was going to say^

Also, You just made an account to post on this topic? :S

 

[Bacon Boy]

What if you're wrong and you're an atheist? :O

If I am wrong and there is a god, I don't want to worship him. Why?
Because either A. He's just some cosmic energy in space that doesn't even know we exist
or B. He watches over us, yet doesn't do anything about starving children, war, and disease just because the first two humans made a mistake.

He put us on the world to see whether we are good enough to get to heaven or hell and if you'll follow the word of God there. If he helped disease, starvation, war and disease he'll be doing everything for us and it wont show who is generous enough to donate to starving children or who will cure the disease or who is willing the save people's lives. Then everybody will be going to hell or heaven as he wouldn't be sure and it wouldn't be a good test.
It's like giving an answer on a test to the students.

See, this is what bothers me about religion. What kind of just being would punish and reward his creations for eternity? How can you justify eternal damnation? Even the most vile people on earth don't deserve to be burned for eternity...that's just sick.

How did I let this go by?
I disagree with what Josh. I can't really explain God's reasoning, as I am not him, but I don't think it's just because he wanted to see us be tested and play around with us.

 

[Slickyrider]

What if you're wrong and you're an atheist? :O

If I am wrong and there is a god, I don't want to worship him. Why?
Because either A. He's just some cosmic energy in space that doesn't even know we exist
or B. He watches over us, yet doesn't do anything about starving children, war, and disease just because the first two humans made a mistake.

First of all, @Moonlight: I see now. Instead, I'm contesting Carl Sagan.

Megaman: Come now, you're smarter than that. Humans need to be advocates for themselves. Why? We would never *censored.3.0*ing learn anything if any sort of God simply solved all of our problems. We need to eliminate war, hunger, and disease by ourselves. We simply cannot allow whatever God there exists to magically solve all of the afformentioned problems, and any more you can come up with!

I know, humans in general are the cause for all the worlds problems, my point is that, what's the point of worshipping this god if he's not doing anything? If that's the case, then it seems to me like all he did was create the universe, told humans stuff for a few years, then just sat back and watched.

Only some humans, Megaman. Not all humans believe that violence is the answer to destroying infidels, and hunger cannot be cured due to its widespread consistency, and eliminating disease would only be cured by biological warfare. Do you believe all of these things? Clearly, you don't.

About the whole "God being lazy" thing, there are many things that humans do not know. We use God, like I said, as a tool, to connect to the unknown higher power of the universe.

Josh: Yeah, I picked up on that too. I mean, we are having an intense discussion about religion, but this is an Animal Crossing forum.

 

[Megamannt125]

Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able, and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God.

 

[moonlight33]

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

The thing is, God will forgive you. Religious or not he will. Some people do bad things and don't give a damn on what they just did like taking somebody's lives from them or completely ruining it.
Even atheist can go into heaven (I'm sure) if you're just good overall.

Not according to Christian Bible. You have to bow down, believe, and have faith (which is a really trivial thing if you think about it.) That should raise an immediate red flag. Why would an all knowing God want to be worshiped or believed in? Is he an ego maniac or something?

Yes! God is an ego maniac! I can tell you myself, it says it in the Old Testament and New Testament.

However, humans should not expect to be treated fairly by God if they do not believe in God. You can't expect a priest to feed you one of those communion wafers if you're not a practicing Catholic, for example.

So we should be judged on our believe rather than our actions? Yeah, that makes perfect sense.

 

[moonlight33]

Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able, and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God.

I was about to post this, but theists still have their lame excuses to combat this, like "We have free will." or "Our sin causes evil" or "God can't get near evil because it's against his nature"

 

[Bacon Boy]

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

First of all, @Moonlight: I see now. Instead, I'm contesting Carl Sagan.

Megaman: Come now, you're smarter than that. Humans need to be advocates for themselves. Why? We would never *censored.3.0*ing learn anything if any sort of God simply solved all of our problems. We need to eliminate war, hunger, and disease by ourselves. We simply cannot allow whatever God there exists to magically solve all of the afformentioned problems, and any more you can come up with!

I know, humans in general are the cause for all the worlds problems, my point is that, what's the point of worshipping this god if he's not doing anything? If that's the case, then it seems to me like all he did was create the universe, told humans stuff for a few years, then just sat back and watched.

Only some humans, Megaman. Not all humans believe that violence is the answer to destroying infidels, and hunger cannot be cured due to its widespread consistency, and eliminating disease would only be cured by biological warfare. Do you believe all of these things? Clearly, you don't.

About the whole "God being lazy" thing, there are many things that humans do not know. We use God, like I said, as a tool, to connect to the unknown higher power of the universe.

Josh: Yeah, I picked up on that too. I mean, we are having an intense discussion about religion, but this is an Animal Crossing forum.

It's not laziness. It's freewill. If God did what we were supposed to do and made the decisions for us, then we wouldn't be free.

 

[Slickyrider]

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Not according to Christian Bible. You have to bow down, believe, and have faith (which is a really trivial thing if you think about it.) That should raise an immediate red flag. Why would an all knowing God want to be worshiped or believed in? Is he an ego maniac or something?

Yes! God is an ego maniac! I can tell you myself, it says it in the Old Testament and New Testament.

However, humans should not expect to be treated fairly by God if they do not believe in God. You can't expect a priest to feed you one of those communion wafers if you're not a practicing Catholic, for example.

So we should be judged on our believe rather than our actions? Yeah, that makes perfect sense.

If humans want to be judged by God, they need to believe in God. Humans are judged solely by their actions.

 

[Josh]

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Not according to Christian Bible. You have to bow down, believe, and have faith (which is a really trivial thing if you think about it.) That should raise an immediate red flag. Why would an all knowing God want to be worshiped or believed in? Is he an ego maniac or something?

Yes! God is an ego maniac! I can tell you myself, it says it in the Old Testament and New Testament.

However, humans should not expect to be treated fairly by God if they do not believe in God. You can't expect a priest to feed you one of those communion wafers if you're not a practicing Catholic, for example.

So we should be judged on our believe rather than our actions? Yeah, that makes perfect sense.

That's what we believe <_<

 

[Sporge27]

I believe people here have reached an impasse.

If you have nothing new to add now would be the time to stop or a lock may be required if tensions rise.

 

[Bacon Boy]

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Not according to Christian Bible. You have to bow down, believe, and have faith (which is a really trivial thing if you think about it.) That should raise an immediate red flag. Why would an all knowing God want to be worshiped or believed in? Is he an ego maniac or something?

Yes! God is an ego maniac! I can tell you myself, it says it in the Old Testament and New Testament.

However, humans should not expect to be treated fairly by God if they do not believe in God. You can't expect a priest to feed you one of those communion wafers if you're not a practicing Catholic, for example.

So we should be judged on our believe rather than our actions? Yeah, that makes perfect sense.

We're judged on both.
You can't get into heaven by just belief or by just good deeds.
You can't say you want to follow Christ and accept him into your heart and then not turn your life around. It's like using Christianity as a scapegoat.

 

[moonlight33]

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Yes! God is an ego maniac! I can tell you myself, it says it in the Old Testament and New Testament.

However, humans should not expect to be treated fairly by God if they do not believe in God. You can't expect a priest to feed you one of those communion wafers if you're not a practicing Catholic, for example.

So we should be judged on our believe rather than our actions? Yeah, that makes perfect sense.

That's what we believe <_<

So let's say that before Hitler died, he repented and prayed to Jayzus to forgive him. He goes on to hell to live in bliss. Now, let's look at Bil Gates, (an atheist.) He has done a lot for the American economy, he's a genius obviously, and he has donated over 30 billion dollars to charity. He doesn't believe, so he will burn in hell, while demons eat him alive, in a never ending fire. Picture it. Imagine good people like that in Hell. Imagine all of the Jews that suffered under the hands of Hitler, dying in gas chambers with their families. Image those peaceful people in Hell right now, suffering even more, just for not praying to Jesus. The thought of that is absolutely vomit inducing.

 

[Slickyrider]

Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able, and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God.

I was about to post this, but theists still have their lame excuses to combat this, like "We have free will." or "Our sin causes evil" or "God can't get near evil because it's against his nature"

Bacon Boy: I know it's free will. Megaman implied that it is laziness.

Moonlight: If you want to reasonably discuss this, do not insult the logic of theists. It's logic! Atheism is based on logic!

That very same logic is reasonable: Humans do have free will, and we have great conviction about our actions. We are not controlled by God or any religious teachings, humans make decisions individually. Was John Wilkes Booth controlled by God, and was his hand guided by an angel to shoot Abraham Lincoln?

Our sins do cause evil. Islamic extremism caused the Afghanistan war. War is pointless. See where I'm going?

God is not evil nor good. Where did you get that idea? God does not act, humans do the actions themselves.

EDIT: Sporge, I implore you, don't lock this topic. We're going along quite well with this reasonable argument. I don't think we'll ever reach a stalemate.

 

[Sporge27]

I posted that more because people seemed to be getting a little flustered, not on any particular side just in general. Just please take a deep breath and read over what you are going to post before you do.

 

[Slickyrider]

Sporge, the great control. Within this reasonable argument, there is a mediator.

 

[Josh]

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

So we should be judged on our believe rather than our actions? Yeah, that makes perfect sense.

That's what we believe <_<

So let's say that before Hitler died, he repented and prayed to Jayzus to forgive him. He goes on to hell to live in bliss. Now, let's look at Bil Gates, (an atheist.) He has done a lot for the American economy, he's a genius obviously, and he has donated over 30 billion dollars to charity. He doesn't believe, so he will burn in hell, while demons eat him alive, in a never ending fire. Picture it. Imagine good people like that in Hell. Imagine all of the Jews that suffered under the hands of Hitler, dying in gas chambers with their families. Image those peaceful people in Hell right now, suffering even more, just for not praying to Jesus. The thought of that is absolutely vomit inducing.

Hitler will go to hell since just saying a simple prayer won't get him out of hell, He also killed different types of people like Disabled, homosexual, blacks, blue eyes, blonds, Jews and people he didn't like.

Now Bill Gates, He's done a lot for the world yeah that's great. But I'm sure (or not sure) if he's saying things like "God isn't real, He doesn't exist! Everybody who believes in God is stupid and God is the devil!" and all *censored.2.0* like that then of course he'll go to hell for doubting. There's a difference between doubting and being sure and being unsure about it.
Also Jesus was a Jew, Why would all of the Jews in the holocaust go to hell? They didn't do anything but be Jewish.

And go ahead vomit, It won't change anything.

 

[Marcus]

The reason I am atheist is that there are too many contradicting facts and philosophies in Religion in general that I cannot see the grain of truth behind the millions of grains of mis-understandings.

 

[moonlight33]

Well from my understanding, Jews denied Jesus and thought that he was fake. The bible also says that the only way to god is through the son (Which really makes no sense at all).

 

[Gnome]

what happened to Yes or No?