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Terrorist Attacks in Paris

Did anyone read the account on Reddit from a Bataclan survivor? It's very chilling and sheds some light on their mission, but not much. All they said was Syria and the French president's name. Killing was random.
 
One thing that drives me crazy is that my country's new prime minister, Justin Trudeau, even after the wake of these events, is more concerned about keeping his campaign promises than doing what's right.

He wants to take in 25,000 refugees by the end of the year, an already lofty goal as it is, and then there's the screening process. Time and efficiency is taking priority over safety. These poor people need help but our country's safety comes first. Take them in, but do it responsiby.

Pulling out our fighter jets and taking in these refugees is the worst thing to do. By taking us out of the fight and taking in refugees, you're doing nothing to stop the reason why they're running in the first place. It's like taking pain killers but doing nothing to treat the wound.

The world is falling apart it seems. So much terror and corruption, violence and segregation. It seems world peace just can't be achieved.
 
Got a link, by chance?
I don't any to because it contains pictures of the aftermath. There are a lot of accounts out now. You can see this all on the post on Reddit's all about the shield used by the police that stormed the Bataclan.
 
One thing that drives me crazy is that my country's new prime minister, Justin Trudeau, even after the wake of these events, is more concerned about keeping his campaign promises than doing what's right.

He wants to take in 25,000 refugees by the end of the year, an already lofty goal as it is, and then there's the screening process. Time and efficiency is taking priority over safety. These poor people need help but our country's safety comes first. Take them in, but do it responsiby.

Pulling out our fighter jets and taking in these refugees is the worst thing to do. By taking us out of the fight and taking in refugees, you're doing nothing to stop the reason why they're running in the first place. It's like taking pain killers but doing nothing to treat the wound.

The world is falling apart it seems. So much terror and corruption, violence and segregation. It seems world peace just can't be achieved.

Because the endless war has really done so well.
 
One thing that drives me crazy is that my country's new prime minister, Justin Trudeau, even after the wake of these events, is more concerned about keeping his campaign promises than doing what's right.

He wants to take in 25,000 refugees by the end of the year, an already lofty goal as it is, and then there's the screening process. Time and efficiency is taking priority over safety. These poor people need help but our country's safety comes first. Take them in, but do it responsiby.

Pulling out our fighter jets and taking in these refugees is the worst thing to do. By taking us out of the fight and taking in refugees, you're doing nothing to stop the reason why they're running in the first place. It's like taking pain killers but doing nothing to treat the wound.

The world is falling apart it seems. So much terror and corruption, violence and segregation. It seems world peace just can't be achieved.

Though I can agree with you on some parts, I'll have to stick with Trudeau.

Though I can't say much on the fighter jet operation, he's right on the refugee front. To send them back to the chaos and devestation directly after a treacherous journey across the Pacific isn't right. To take these people in is to regain trust with the country of Syria, once or if it ever regains control.
 
So, what do you expect Obama do to? Bomb them some more? Let's do that. Then ISIS/Daesh can say "Look at the West! They're bombing our towns, killing your families! There is a war on Islam, join us so we can fight it!" That's how groups like this get started in the first place. Our bombings help the radical groups recruit more people.
If I may add to this: the daesh don't have rational thought. Think of the ways France could have responded to the Paris attacks.
1. Continue bombing as they have;
2. Increase intensity of bombing;
3. Stop bombing.

In all three situations, the daesh will yell "WE WON : DDDD". In their minds they have trapped the countries fighting against them, and anything they or other countries do means they have won.

Examples:
A country decides to bomb us? We won. Doesn't matter if we attacked them first.
One of our militiamen dies in battle? He's won. His task given to him by Allah has been completed.
The entire world rejects our vision? We've won. We've shown how the world is against Islam.

This is the way they think.

It's a deranged Islamic ideology that has no basis in the real world. It's also why I reject the argument that poverty is the main cause of young men joining them. I think it's that they already had a mental issue.

He wants to take in 25,000 refugees by the end of the year, an already lofty goal as it is, and then there's the screening process. Time and efficiency is taking priority over safety. These poor people need help but our country's safety comes first. Take them in, but do it responsiby.
25000 is a lot of people, but you have to put it in perspective. In my country, The Netherlands, we have ~17 million people. Canada has ~36 million people. This country will have taken at least 60k people by the end of the year. At the moment, Canada has taken about 3000, with that plan to take 25k more. Canada is over 200 times as big, and The Netherlands doesn't have any involvement in the Syrian civil war (yet).

Do you really think taking half of what my country has will destabilize your society? After the Paris attacks, some extra security measures have been taken, but that's because we are so close to the attacks (for the most part). The amount of radicalized individuals here is minimal compared to France. If you have faith in your country's systems, then those refugees won't hurt you.

I agree that there need to be extra safety precautions, but to close your borders to people in need is cruel, and will only fuel the daesh's narrative.

I'm feeling the subjects being discussed in here are irrelevant.
While it hasn't been confirmed that it was one of the terrorists, a passport was found of a Syrian male that passed through Greece, Serbia, Austria, and some other countries, in just the last month and a half. They found a man with the same passport but no further information about that has been made available.

Apart from that, the daesh are a big factor in why there's a stream of refugees at all. To say that it's irrelevant to their actions in Paris (where they even clearly stated "this is for your actions in Syria") is to ignore the facts.



At this point, nations are taking this group more seriously and realizing that Assad's dictatorship has actually left some people with no choice but to join them. Even Putin has decided to abandon Assad, one of his allies, in favor of helping western countries bomb the daesh and allow for proper democratic elections in Syria. It's a disappointment that it's taken so long for this to happen, but at least it is happening now.

And even when the daesh are gone, there will be some terrorist organization to wreak havoc in the Middle East and perhaps even in other countries. Don't forget that before ISIS came into view, the big name in everybody's minds was al Qaeda. They are still busy, and I would say that due to pressure being on the daesh instead of them, they have managed to gain some more strength. Until stability can be brought to the Middle East and Africa, these organizations will sadly continue existing.

The only thing we can do is make sure our governments keep their own civilians secure, but treat the refugees humanely as well. That's the way to piss off the terrorists and show them that their methods aren't effective.
 
I was at work when I learned about this and I could not believe what I was hearing since we have not had such a gruesome terrorist attack in the western hemisphere since 9/11 more than 14 years ago [I still remember that day quite vividly]. I'm truly saddened for all the families that lost loved ones that day. I hope these **** ******** pay for what they did and we as a civilized world defeat this barbaric group once and for all. These evil people have revoked their inalienable right to live after killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people for various reasons. This latest attack is a declaration of war to NATO under Article V of the agreement that created it. Hopefully, Obama will finally get out of his delusional view of his "strategy" and start actually engaging these people in all-out war. Unfortunately, Obama is most likely not going to get the job done by leading the world through this regardless of the dire circumstances and instead give this job to the next President (which I personally hope is not a Democrat because they will do nothing about this; all you have to do is watch the latest democratic debate to know this). :/
 
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I was at work when I learned about this and I could not believe what I was hearing since we have not had such a gruesome terrorist attack in the western hemisphere since 9/11 more than 14 years ago [I still remember that day quite vividly]. I'm truly saddened for all the families that lost loved ones that day.

It's been pretty much confirmed at this point that IS blew up that Russian plane, which killed nearly twice as many people as in the Paris attacks. I know it's not as 'gruesome' as the Paris killings, but there have been plenty of terrorist attacks - especially the Norway attacks which fit pretty much any definition of terrorism but were commited by a far-right white person.


I hope these **** ******** pay for what they did and we as a civilized world defeat this barbaric group once and for all. These evil people have revoked their inalienable right to live after killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people for various reasons. This latest attack is a declaration of war to NATO under Article V of the agreement that created it. Hopefully, Obama will finally get out of his delusional view of his "strategy" and start actually engaging these people in all-out war. Unfortunately, Obama is most likely not going to get the job done by leading the world through this regardless of the dire circumstances and instead give this job to the next President (which I personally hope is not a Democrat because they will do nothing about this; all you have to do is watch the latest democratic debate to know this). :/

When you start cheering for all-out war is when you know you've lost the argument. America has killed 1,147 people trying to kill 41 wanted men. That's over a thousand 'acceptable casualties', every one of which will have family and friends who'll rightly want to fight the West. There's no moral justification for this.
 
It's been pretty much confirmed at this point that IS blew up that Russian plane, which killed nearly twice as many people as in the Paris attacks. I know it's not as 'gruesome' as the Paris killings, but there have been plenty of terrorist attacks - especially the Norway attacks which fit pretty much any definition of terrorism but were commited by a far-right white person.




When you start cheering for all-out war is when you know you've lost the argument. America has killed 1,147 people trying to kill 41 wanted men. That's over a thousand 'acceptable casualties', every one of which will have family and friends who'll rightly want to fight the West. There's no moral justification for this.

For the first point, the Paris attacks actually had far more lives impacted and was far more destructive than the Russian plane being blown up. According the sources which I will list at the end of my post, the Russian plane bomb killed 224 while the Paris attacks killed 136 and INJURED 430. So because of this, the recent event in Paris is the largest terrorist attack since 9/11.

For the second point, all is fair in war. In order to truly win wars (like we did back in WWII), you sometimes have to make sacrifices of some sort in order to achieve victory. Of course no one wants to kill innocent civilians, but what would you do if you had an enemy that needed to be defeated, but they hid strategically around innocents knowing we are going to be hesitant? Would you rather sit there and let them continue their evil, or will you surprise them and defeat them with great ease? Bombings are not the answer by the way to solve this issue ultimately (even though strategic bombings may be necessary for victory). Whether we like it or not, what we should be doing is sending in ground troops so that the casualties among innocents is minimized.

Sources for 1st point:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/November_2015_Paris_attacks
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/17/egypt-plane-crash-bomb-jet-russia-security-service
 
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And now the soccer match between the Netherlands and Germany in Hannover has been cancelled, people advised to evacuate.

According to reports there's a suspicious package, as well as a bomb car disguised as a rescue vehicle.

Let's hope it's just a scare.

Edit: I don't feel this warrants bumping the thread. Press conference confirmed there were no bombs found, so it was just a scare. Phew.
 
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For the first point, the Paris attacks actually had far more lives impacted and was far more destructive than the Russian plane being blown up. According the sources which I will list at the end of my post, the Russian plane bomb killed 224 while the Paris attacks killed 136 and INJURED 430. So because of this, the recent event in Paris is the largest terrorist attack since 9/11.

If you're going by number injured, then sure. But terrorism didn't begin with 9/11. The IRA carried out over 10,000 bomb attacks over several decades, but thanks to the peace process and people sitting down and talking, Sinn Fein is now an elected political party in Ireland. You have to be prepared to talk to make peace, and every time innocent (or not) people are killed by the West, martyrs are added to their cause.


For the second point, all is fair in war. In order to truly win wars (like we did back in WWII), you sometimes have to make sacrifices of some sort in order to achieve victory. Of course no one wants to kill innocent civilians, but what would you do if you had an enemy that needed to be defeated, but they hid strategically around innocents knowing we are going to be hesitant? Would you rather sit there and let them continue their evil, or will you surprise them and defeat them with great ease? Bombings are not the answer by the way to solve this issue ultimately (even though strategic bombings may be necessary for victory). Whether we like it or not, what we should be doing is sending in ground troops so that the casualties among innocents is minimized.

Sources for 1st point:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/November_2015_Paris_attacks
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/17/egypt-plane-crash-bomb-jet-russia-security-service

'All's fair in war' is an extremely dangerous rhetoric and everyone should be very wary of it - it opens the door for all kinds of reforms, including (especially!) governments spying on their own people in the name of national security.

Even in WWII, 'everything wasn't fair'. Chemical agents like mustard gas were used in WWI to horrific effects, so chemical weapons in WWII were made but never used, because it was too horrific; if one side used gas, the other may have retaliated.

I don't have the answers, and I'm definitely not saying there's a bloodless solution to the problem, but the American Republican rhetoric of 'bomb them all, then bomb them some more' is dangerous, immoral and counter-productive.
 
A cell phone used by one of the attackers on Friday was found yesterday. It led police to an apartment in Paris. Authorities said that more terrorists were hiding there, and that they were planning attacks that would be carried out in the La D?fense district on Wednesday.

During the raid on the apartment, a woman blew herself up, killing the police dog that was sent to investigate. Another suspect was killed in a firefight, while 7 others were arrested. Apart from the dog, Diesel, no other police officers lost their lives. 5 were reported to be lightly wounded.

A church in the same neighborhood was also raided as it was believed there was a cache of weapons hidden inside. That turned out to be a false alarm.

772cb206be.jpg
 
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Read there was a suspisous looking wheelie bag in the newspaper which was thought to be a b o m b at a stadium all the spectators were told to go straight home. Was this a b o m b or just a false alarm? Didnt read much as was getting off bus
 
Read there was a suspisous looking wheelie bag in the newspaper which was thought to be a b o m b at a stadium all the spectators were told to go straight home. Was this a b o m b or just a false alarm? Didnt read much as was getting off bus
Read post #352. It was a false alarm.
 
If I may add to this: the daesh don't have rational thought. Think of the ways France could have responded to the Paris attacks.
1. Continue bombing as they have;
2. Increase intensity of bombing;
3. Stop bombing.

In all three situations, the daesh will yell "WE WON : DDDD". In their minds they have trapped the countries fighting against them, and anything they or other countries do means they have won.

Examples:
A country decides to bomb us? We won. Doesn't matter if we attacked them first.
One of our militiamen dies in battle? He's won. His task given to him by Allah has been completed.
The entire world rejects our vision? We've won. We've shown how the world is against Islam.

This is the way they think.

It's a deranged Islamic ideology that has no basis in the real world. It's also why I reject the argument that poverty is the main cause of young men joining them. I think it's that they already had a mental issue.


25000 is a lot of people, but you have to put it in perspective. In my country, The Netherlands, we have ~17 million people. Canada has ~36 million people. This country will have taken at least 60k people by the end of the year. At the moment, Canada has taken about 3000, with that plan to take 25k more. Canada is over 200 times as big, and The Netherlands doesn't have any involvement in the Syrian civil war (yet).

Do you really think taking half of what my country has will destabilize your society? After the Paris attacks, some extra security measures have been taken, but that's because we are so close to the attacks (for the most part). The amount of radicalized individuals here is minimal compared to France. If you have faith in your country's systems, then those refugees won't hurt you.

I agree that there need to be extra safety precautions, but to close your borders to people in need is cruel, and will only fuel the daesh's narrative.


While it hasn't been confirmed that it was one of the terrorists, a passport was found of a Syrian male that passed through Greece, Serbia, Austria, and some other countries, in just the last month and a half. They found a man with the same passport but no further information about that has been made available.

Apart from that, the daesh are a big factor in why there's a stream of refugees at all. To say that it's irrelevant to their actions in Paris (where they even clearly stated "this is for your actions in Syria") is to ignore the facts.



At this point, nations are taking this group more seriously and realizing that Assad's dictatorship has actually left some people with no choice but to join them. Even Putin has decided to abandon Assad, one of his allies, in favor of helping western countries bomb the daesh and allow for proper democratic elections in Syria. It's a disappointment that it's taken so long for this to happen, but at least it is happening now.

And even when the daesh are gone, there will be some terrorist organization to wreak havoc in the Middle East and perhaps even in other countries. Don't forget that before ISIS came into view, the big name in everybody's minds was al Qaeda. They are still busy, and I would say that due to pressure being on the daesh instead of them, they have managed to gain some more strength. Until stability can be brought to the Middle East and Africa, these organizations will sadly continue existing.

The only thing we can do is make sure our governments keep their own civilians secure, but treat the refugees humanely as well. That's the way to piss off the terrorists and show them that their methods aren't effective.
The Syrian passport has been confirmed fake. The passport belonged to a migrant that came to Europe from Turkey.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...adf3f4-8d53-11e5-934c-a369c80822c2_story.html
 
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The Syrian passport has been confirmed fake. The passport belonged to a migrant that came to Europe from Turkey.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...adf3f4-8d53-11e5-934c-a369c80822c2_story.html
After reports came in that a man with the exact same passport (albeit with a different picture) had been detained in Serbia, it was obvious that it was a fake passport. I remember there also being a report today that the actual Ahmad al Mohammad had been killed in Syria some months ago, though I can't find the source now.

The fact that the fake passport traveled through other countries to eventually arrive at France raises some questions regardless. It obviously wasn't the man that's still in Serbia, as he would be in France. And it was obviously evidence that was meant to be found, so this discussion would start and people would take the daesh's threats seriously. As the source you linked says, it's obvious that terrorists can and will hide in the stream of migrants.

Edit: Thought I'd slap some sources on statements as well.

Guy in Serbia with same passport arrested
Passport was recorded in Croatian refugee camp (after it passed through Serbia) 1 2

Edit 2: Found the source about the real Ahmad al Mohammad. 1 2
 
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