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Mafia Mafia: Trouble in Alola (Day 2)

That's the thing though, unless he was doing something very specific relevant to his role, there's no reason to say that he's "not disclosing anything" and think that he, even 3 years ago, understood that you should change your playstyle in an attempt to be more active and improve

well those questions on the RQS was about his playstyle and how he acts. i dont see why he didnt just say it wouldnt apply since hes trying really hard to "change his playstyle"

and tbh asking someone to improve is probably too much of an hassle to them when they can take the easy way out

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... why did zendel just upvote my post?

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... why did zendel just upvote my post?
 
I'm typing my reads now, and lord there is so much to put suspicion on everyone in this game tbh....
 
Was reading back and realized I referenced the wrong game. Meant Smash mafia when referring to my scum play
 
I have no idea what is happening right now. Where did half of my OP go?

WTF!

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I'll try to to fix it now.
 
okay we havent done anything and its almost 24 hours soon so i want more discussion

im a bit uneasy about how theres little being said

id like to see the playerlist because i dont want to forget a player but..its gone rn so

we havent really discussed WHY karen and cleb were killed - theres a few possible reasons. besides dolby and kirby, those two were the only ones who touched up on that.

now we all know dolby was an expert bluesniper but im curious and am asking all of you - how many of you thought karen was a blue? she made it kinda obvious... with a strategy in mind of course, and i think someone experienced could have also seen through her granny bluff but thats like 30 levels of thonker right there. we could go with the simple route and that the scum just thought she was a blue (it was obvious) but didnt even think she claimed granny

1. Scum team are noobs and didn't even notice Karen claimed granny.

This rules out Dolby and I for the most part - I have no idea if scum!trundle would have saw that because he did say he didn't read most of the pages.

I also feel like Jacob/Daniel would have seen that as well. Toads I'm not sure if he knew what a granny was - its not a common role in TBT mafia anymore like it used to be.


2. Karen was essentially cleared town and could become a confirmed town leader so they killed her.

I don't remember much people suspecting Karen. She was the most active and most people had written her off as town or third party.

3. bluesniping and saw through Karen's granny claim and came to the conclusion she was bluffing to protect herself and be able to use her power throughout the game without worrying about mafia/third party

Dolby is our resident bluesniper, let's not forget that reputation. However, I do know he's very calculated and would have saw the risks of killing a granny n1 - it would have reduced his KP by 1 potentially. And I don't think karen would have died either way. BUT, there's also the possibility that he saw through the bluff and knew she was using reverse psychology to keep herself alive.

I'm a bit uneasy on Dolby, but I can bring up posts comparing his scum and town style if people want. I don't see his scum style right now, but I may be wrong because everyone finds Dolby hard to read.


Now let's talk about Cleb

1. Cleb was killed to frame Kirby

This seems to be the accepted consensus, makes sense and would collaborate with my noob scum granny theory as well. A very simple thing.

2. Cleb was getting close to getting all the mafia team right.

Cleb had more original thoughts imo, and was much more aggressive. However, no one seemed to have cared or listened to Cleb so it's unlikely that Cleb could have persuaded a lynch on scum either way.


3. Cleb was suspected of being a blue.


Bluesniping again.


There's also the thought of why Ness was blackmailed - I'm not too sure myself. It seems it could have also been a frame on Apple2013/Trundle, but perhaps they suspected he had a watcher/cop role and could have done something. There's also the chance they blackmailed Ness to shut him up if he was getting close. I suspect Ness will die since he's clear (unless there is third party - however there were only 2 kills last night so i dont see a serial killer) - if there is a town blackmailer (does that exist?) they would maybe claim...


What does make me uneasy is that this game is an experimental game. We know Bianaca was originally intended to be a 1 shot vig, so she's not the wacky part of this game. Blackmailer I see has been used before so that's not too unusual either. We had a normal cop as well.

I'm wondering if there is a third party besides a serial killer/survivor/jester among us, maybe a cult leader.


Just to keep in mind - we have not seen anything too out of the ordinary yet and I'm a bit worried this will **** us all over later.

Other possibilities of third party

Arsonist - this would explain the lack of 3 kills, as well as fitting into the experimental category. They would have to get a few players ready to be flamed before killing them all.


I'd like to discuss these possibilities - right now the way we're headed, we are only considering lynching nubs.

If I had to pick Dolby or Trundle to be on scum team, I'd pick Dolby. That said, Zendel seems inexperienced and I'm not sure if he would have thought about balancing based of experience - however despite that, there is still the chance that Dolby or Trundle ended up scum by the luck of the draw anyway.

As for some other people, right now I think Kirby is trying hard from his scum style. All I remember from watching him briefly was short posts and saying "uhhh i want to kill dad". He somewhat made a case and as scum he seemed at most to question people a lot.

Toads I just don't think is confident enough to lead a lynch as scum. I feel like he would try to keep as much pressure off him as possible. I think this was his first real strong conviction and he wanted to be more assertive. I just don't see him taking this risk of all of this backfiring on him as scum when he could have coasted by.

Daniel/Jacob I am unsure about, I wouldn't really clear them either though. Null for me.

Trundle I feel is town, I will probably expand on this feeling later.. But that being said, I think Zendel said he cannot answer if there are safeclaims right.?


Are there safeclaims for scum?

Just to be sure.


As for the rest, there's not really been too much from Sensai/Chick/FN so... I feel like giving FN the benefit of the doubt since he did say before the game even started he would try to do this... "playstyle"

Unsure of ITYW and Farobi.


That being said, I do want to look back on Day 1's lynch. I unfortunately was swayed to thinking Bianca's slip was real and not just a typo of her words, but the wagon happened very fast to steer off Sensai.
 
That big post Chick made makes me feel like they only made it so they don't get modkilled.

going to post a reads list again.
 
That big post Chick made makes me feel like they only made it so they don't get modkilled.

going to post a reads list again.

Yeah, I kinda got that impression when the best they could do was post about me, but didn't actually read them or take them into account considering she somehow thought my post about Karen's granny plan...was about her....????????
 
I think the cleb lynch was strange tbh, while Cleb is touted as a very strong player, he was kind of unraveling this game a little bit. Had I been on scumteam I wouldn't have thought to shoot him N1 with what he had done so far.... I would've aimed for Kallie or Dolby. Making me believe one of the two had to be behind the shots, and increases my suspicions of Dolby because I highly doubt its Kallie. Cleb shot is not a Kirby frame... not to be rude, but trying to frame Kirby is never a good plan, nor do I think anyone would think thats a good idea given Kirby's track record.

Ness blackmail honestly I could see as scum using it on themselves. I had the same idea first thing when I had a blackmailer in SU2, however we decided to do one person first, then blackmail our own scum the next night (we didn't last long enough to do it and Dolby got to talk anyway). We chose dolby though because obvious town leader. Here Ness isn't even that vocal, and you will see soon, I have my mafia suspicions of Ness anyway.

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If we had an arsonist, wouldn't someone have told us they were doused already?

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and tbh, looking on day 1 I thought Karen would be mafia... riding the coattails of how FN1 claimed jester/acted crazy then turned out to be detective. Now I see they were doing that, but genuinely lol
 
I think the cleb lynch was strange tbh, while Cleb is touted as a very strong player, he was kind of unraveling this game a little bit. Had I been on scumteam I wouldn't have thought to shoot him N1 with what he had done so far.... I would've aimed for Kallie or Dolby. Making me believe one of the two had to be behind the shots, and increases my suspicions of Dolby because I highly doubt its Kallie. Cleb shot is not a Kirby frame... not to be rude, but trying to frame Kirby is never a good plan, nor do I think anyone would think thats a good idea given Kirby's track record.

Ness blackmail honestly I could see as scum using it on themselves. I had the same idea first thing when I had a blackmailer in SU2, however we decided to do one person first, then blackmail our own scum the next night (we didn't last long enough to do it and Dolby got to talk anyway). We chose dolby though because obvious town leader. Here Ness isn't even that vocal, and you will see soon, I have my mafia suspicions of Ness anyway.

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If we had an arsonist, wouldn't someone have told us they were doused already?

Yeah, I thought the kill was weird too - I mean he was keeping everyone on their toes - but also, he was nowhere close to swaying town. At most, people were unsure of him. He could have made a case and I feel like everyone would have ignored it unfortunately, I do think he has the smarts to find scum - but he doesn't have the charisma to make people believe him first.

If I was scum I probably would have dealt with him later, I didn't really see many people bouncing off Cleb's ideas or noticing him at all.

Also I'm unsure by what you mean that framing Kirby is a bad idea, elaborate? Is there some past game meta I'm unaware of? Also, what about Trundle?


And oh, good one! I have never played with a blackmailer before nor can I find a role like this on the mafia wiki so I didn't know if scum could use it on themselves..I had never thought of that. Good idea, Toads.

And arsonist victims aren't told I think, but given this is Sun and Moon I kinda feel like its more likely we have a cult leader. I didnt finish the game coz im lazy but the Aether Foundation pretty much seems like a cult to me, and given the fact theres two bad factions (team skulls is probably mafia).

It would fit the experiment part though, except the fact this is a 15 player game and the idea of a CL scares me because its pretty much going to be impossible now with our cop and vig gone...

Still I would expect the unexpected to happen this game tbh, who knows.
 
we should all mass claim if we mislynch today. I'm not a person who likes mass claims but we should only do it if we are losing.
 
we should all mass claim if we mislynch today. I'm not a person who likes mass claims but we should only do it if we are losing.

At this point I only think we have a doctor left so I guess, there's not that much room for any more players and I thnik daniel said were at LyLo soon
 
oh god.... I made my whole reads list, and now I'm getting different feelings about everything

jiminey crickets. Long story short, I think my proposed scum team is Dolby, Trundle, Sensai or one is actually a TP (still not convinced) and add in one of the newish people like FN1, ITYW, Farobi (least likely to me), or Chick. Full reads to come still

Ness and trundle had a little exchange I read up on, and it doesn't seem like they could be together on a team, but Trundle did a lot of bussing in SU2, which I'm seeing lots of parallels to him in that game and this. Ness still seems scummy, but interactions with Trundle make me feel otherwise.

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why is cellar main page freaking out so much.... I can't even get to it to ISO people
 
oh god.... I made my whole reads list, and now I'm getting different feelings about everything

jiminey crickets. Long story short, I think my proposed scum team is Dolby, Trundle, Sensai or one is actually a TP (still not convinced) and add in one of the newish people like FN1, ITYW, Farobi (least likely to me), or Chick. Full reads to come still

Ness and trundle had a little exchange I read up on, and it doesn't seem like they could be together on a team, but Trundle did a lot of bussing in SU2, which I'm seeing lots of parallels to him in that game and this. Ness still seems scummy, but interactions with Trundle make me feel otherwise.

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why is cellar main page freaking out so much.... I can't even get to it to ISO people

I think you're getting pretty paranoid here considering I am always the one to do the bussing as mafia - I never get bussed by my team effectively unless I've dug myself in too deep of a whole. Honestly, I'm still unsure about Dolby. I feel like there could be a mafia between Dolby and kallie however I see no red flags in their posts. BTW, congrats on 10k posts Kirby.
 
ok, well I can't get to ISO more of Ninja, so here... I don't feel like this is my best work, but I'm getting tired of working on these tbh. I've flip flopped a lot of stuff and alignments while going through the thread. I did just re-read most of it. If something sounds weird, I can clarify. I want to vote for Trundle today though. I feel like I couldn't find the right words for certain things, but at least you can see my general thoughts about everyone so far, and I hope I have made up for my lack of existence since this started.

Kallie ? Lord help us if Kallie is scum, because I don?t think anyone of us will catch her. Going back to RQS her answers feel really genuine and not scripted or trying to hide anything (unlike most others this game) and her effort so far to me doesn?t feel like it is fabricated for like mafia use. Just like my trust in Dolby last game, I?m going to trust her for this game.

Dolby ? Copy Paste from earlier. the one thing that is sticking out to me is Dolby's scum leans list. There is no way all the scum are in that list without a more experienced player to balance it out (fire ninja I know has played a lot of games, but is still "new" if you get what I'm saying). Also Dolby takes a sentence out of every reads list to remind people why he thinks I'm town-leaning, despite me not really having any credibility for it tbh. I think its because he sees me saying I'm going to post reads and come back, knows I'm town, knows I will make myself look townier (when I actually follow through with my promises) and is trying to beat everyone to the punch. If this all makes sense. Dolby is a very smart player, and I don't get the same vibes as last game in this game, something feels way more calculated. His defense of ?well I don?t think zendel would follow that model? feels weak to me. I think he would know that a very experienced player would have to be on the mafia team, and I bet he is that person.


Ness ?you have been acting really suspicious so far tbh. The jump on Jacob for his mistake was weird, but I don?t think you would?ve been so committed to lynching him if you were scum. Were missing your trademark aggressive scumhunt day 1, but the exchange between you and Trundle doesn?t seem staged. While Trundle has bussed scummates before, I don?t see it as being characteristic of you. I also think your change in effort is because you have real-life stuff happening too.

Jacob → Daniel ? is an idiot for thinking Bowie was in the game, no point in hashing this out more. But I tend to make my slip-ups like that when I?m town, then regretting the heck out of them (see Mystic Messenger where I said some stupid things) and that early in his first few posts, he wouldn?t have been so careless. Daniel seems fine so far.

Fireninja1 ? lol, you did the same thing as Jacob and then agreed to lynch him for it. As well as, sussed Jacob for talking about Bowie who hadn?t posted when Kermittea did the exact same thing about Trundle, but you didn?t mention that. Your push on Trundle after Day 1 feels more genuine though and I can agree more with this train of thought than the start of day 1.

SensaiGallade ? of all the coasters, you are the biggest one. In the Jacob mistake thing, you joined in on the convo and raised suspicions about it, but didn?t seem very convinced to do anything regarding it. Nothing else is very town progressive, just whining and defending yourself.

Trundler ? A brash apple is a scary apple. His current posts remind me of when we were on mafia together in Steven Universe and he really didn?t give a crap about what anybody thought. However, I can understand his frustration he has voiced , hence why I had him as null first and completely understand if that?s the root of his current behavior. Claimed Townie: Kukui. When we got safe claims in SU2, he was very quick to use it. The fact that you are so eagerly trying to get people to see that claim as town-aligning for you is scummy after I remembered this. Looking at Cleb/Trundle as far as standpoint goes they had opposing views on a lot of stuff, so I could see him targeting him, so could be why he could?ve targeted him. All of this just isn?t sitting well with me when looking at Trundle in this game. Exchange between him and Ness stuck out as scum v town. I would probably want to lynch him today, because I think it can be telling of a lot of other people in this game too.

Kirbystarship ? Kirby feels like he is trying to contribute in his own little way. I think with him, he overly tries to scumhunt as town, but he gets sussed a lot because idk, its not very good? He usually just subtlely goes along with whatever when he is scum. Theres more of him generating new topics than last game.

Farobi ? I feel like you are just lazy a lot of the times. However, some of the posts and topics you talk about don?t seem very mafia aligned. If there is a 3rd party, my guess would be its you but I don?t think we have any, so I bet its just I haven?t played with you much.

ItookYourWaffles ? I?m guessing its my unfamiliarity with you, but I see your effort, but certain things also don?t sit well with me. Your posts sometimes feel like like hollow content/ posting to be seen, but its not really town progressive.

Chick ? the minimal effort is disconcerting, and by far the easiest ploy to coast as mafia especially given all the other things that went on in this game so far. I don?t want to just say, minimal effort/coasting noob scum, but that?s what it is looking like.

Two biggest scum-leads are Trundle and Dolby, looking for a Trundle lynch as I said earlier.

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I would vote him now, if I could get to the thread
 
Not gonna quote that post but I didn't use the claim in SU2 until I needed to as I'm sure you remember. Zendel got locked in convo with that role (whatever role it was, it's like bartender) and used the first claim. Not sure why your reads are shifting so hard in such a short amount of time. If you're town, I'm genuinely surprised.

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Also interesting you are really accusatory of me bussing/being bussed while your two main scum reads (Dolby and I) are pretty townlock on each other right now. He's more townlock on me than I am on him, but it is a bit of a contradiction in your thought process.
 
I think if we were to lynch one of the two, it should be Dolby - not Trundle.

Trundle I feel is town, but I'm willing to expand on it but it requires me claiming.

Trundle has seem more logical and composed this game so I don't really agree he's scum, but I haven't played with him in years...

Also Zendel I'm sorry if I'm being hard on you for your hosting, I am just kind of tired of all the unbalanced games so far and I was kind of annoyed you deleted the player list because I thought that was on purpose for whatever reason (deleting a lot of text is so hard on mobile so idk how you did that lmfao)
 
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