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Mafia TBT Mafia: Steven Universe 2 Mafia!!! Town and Kat win!!!!

I've finally finished rereading this (at this point) immense thread. Time to leave a town->scum reads list.[->->->->->]

xCleb: In no situation does an unconfident newbie sling this at their mafia partner. (And qwertie, regardless of the fact that they've played before quite a while ago, does fit that description) Otherwise, their (cleb) content hasn't been particularly great and they're in the honeymoon stage of not being terrible anymore, which means they're a little.. overconfident? Not quite the right word, more like an amalgamation of entitled and pretentious, but those words are both too strong.

bri:Wildly obvious competent new town. Many people in the thread draw parallels to amanda's first game, which I think is pretty inaccurate, as amanda had a extremely analytical approach. bri's approach is much more obviously not artificial, and quite a bit harder to fake if bri is actually mafia. (Which I strongly believe is not the case.) Bri's towntells range from her initial reaction upon entering thread, her reaction to ayaya's pressure, and her easily followable logic behind her reads list, regardless of whether I agreed or not. Very impressed with her content as a new player, toboot.

Toads: Rose the roleblocker is back again. I think toads is nothing short of shockingly, blatantly, wildly obvious town. I tend to avoid the use of meta and am an ardent disciple of trying to generate your reads as much from the content of the game as possible, but for some people like toads there's giant meta flags like his town panic that just let you easily pinpoint his alignment. Of course, if he's actually mafia I'd be nothing short of impressed, but that's because it is quite unlikely that he is.

Kirby: Interaction with Qwerty is quite positive, but this green read is more of a "not mafia" read than a "town read". Given Kirby's erratic play, I'd argue that it makes most sense if he was a fool role, but that regardless, lynching him is quite a poor idea.

Dolby: I'm reticent to townread Dolby, as he's quite good at producing genuine content from a red perspective, but in this case I just agree with a lot of his reads, while funnily enough not as much with his reasoning. This is a tenative read at best, and is subject to change. But if Dolby is town he's a solid asset, although not as much as he would be to a mafia team.

SansaiGallade: With regard to your reads, someone being 'rational with decisions' is a demonstration of competence, not a towntell. A towntell is, by nature, something someone wouldn't be able to do - or is unlikely to do - as mafia. Aside from that, your reasoning is fine, and I'm quite fond of your reasoning on Zendel even though I disagree with it's indication of alignment. See, my read on Zendel is that he's someone who presents a fake front as a person, in and out of mafia. The reason I've slotted you in townreads despite arguably bashing most of your reads is because I can see the reasoning behind why you came to them. By all means, you could still be mafia, but I find that scenario considerably less likely than that of you being town.

Byngo: I've gotta admit, prior to ISOing you in prep for writing this, I was incredibly skeptical of the townreads on you. But despite your short posts and brief summeries, a lot of your content is original and quite followable. I especially appreciated your reads list even though you didn't got very in depth to justify your reads.

Zendel: Stop. Posting. I don't mean that as an insult, I don't mean to say your content is particularly bad, because overall you've been quite nice and you have been quite clearly trying to contribute to town. I don't literally mean stop posting all together, I mean ~70 posts in a ~54 hour period is kinda crazy town. Try to post less one liners and make your posts a little more compact. As for why I'm reading him as town, that's due to the nature of the wagon on zendel as day 1 ended, which was nothing short of extremely suspect. I have to admit that I incorrectly had zendel tagged as mafia initially because I thought his play changed just after someone suggested that he played slightly differently as town to immitate the way they suggested, but found out I was incorrect in that case. This is by no means a strong read and is on the weaker end of my town reads.

Panda: Didn't have time to do an ISO, but content reminds me mostly of townpanda, nothing conclusive here. Reasonably weak read. Didn't feel anything opportunistic and I could follow most of the logic she applied, regardless of whether I agreed with it or not.

Yzanda: Yzanda, content is the life of a game of mafia. I realise this game is nothing short of horribly intimidating, but I urge you to try and share your thoughts on who is what based on how people are interacting. If you are town, you needn't worry. New players are pretty obvious town as town once they've started talking.

Apple/Trundle: Not half as much content as regularly, but that's just because he's busy. Important to note that while his reads appear to be on point, that he has quite the bad habit of busing as mafia, so that's not super indicative of his alignment. Looking forward to seeing more of his content after he has more time.

Mogyay: Nothing particularly allignment indicative out of mog yet. I find the alleged cases against her nothing short of horribly weak, and, if required, will dismantle them. That being said, I don't think mogyay's game so far has had any particularly large indications of her being town, so at null she stays.

Heyden: I'm probably being a copout here, but heyden's town game is debilitating enough for town that his mafia play is reasonably difficult to distinguish from it. And I can't conclude anything major from his content, which is mostly air.

Kermit/Karen: Didn't have time to ISO, don't recall anything alignment indicative in her posts at all. That being said, I think all her content is within her playstyle, and that the people pushing her have got quite a bad case.

Uttamori: Floored that anyone has a townread in this direction. They have about 10-15 game related posts, which are 90% air. They've produced 3 townreads, 2 of which are satisfied with a 1 line description, the other of which is the no brainer post-lynch kirby read. I saw some people claim that Utta is fulfilling their meta, but I just absolutely don't buy that when their play would take subzero effort to fake as mafia.

Curry: Only one post of his actually contributes to the game. (well 2, if you count this one. But only one major post) In that post he demostrates a horrific push on Kermit, scumreading her for something both he and I know she would do as town. Arguably, you could put this down to him being super stressed from work and overthinking, so I'm willing to give him plenty of breathing room here and I don't really think pressuring here will have any positive effect at all. Hope you have some more free time soon curry.

Ayaya: Not entirely sure where the townreads were coming from early in the day phase here. Well, maybe I'm being too harsh by saying that. For example: this post is fantastic. It applies an appropriate amount of pressure and progresses the discussion at a sweet pace. It's exactly what I'd have done early in the day phase if I was a player rather than a replacement. That being said, brijade's initial answer was clear and concise. You can argue that this post could be warranted, I wouldn't agree at all, but that's an arguable position, whereas the bri-related content here feels a lot more like ayaya is trying to appear like she is facilitating discussion rather than actually doing it. If I were to use an analogy here it'd be "beating a dead horse", but that wouldn't be quite right, it's more like milking a dry cow.
Lots of people attacked Ayaya's null read list, but while I find it incredibly difficult to comprehend a scenario where you've read all those goddamn pages and not managed to get quite lengthy opinions about most if not all the contributors, a null read list is simply not a scumtell. It will never be a scumtell. In fact, if anything, it would be a towntell, because mafia are more liable to lie and claim to have reads to appear less suspicious. But it isn't anything. Ayaya is possibly mafia, but if she is mafia, it isn't because of the reads list.

Kat: I don't have time to ISO her because there's quite a bit of content, and consequently this read might change when I have the time to go through her posts and re-conclude tomorrow. I think that's more on the unlikely side than the likely side though, as a lot of her posts felt quite off to me, and her play near EoD felt opportunistic.
 
@Endless - I'm not quite a nub like you think I am tbh; it's only really that the forum I have the most games on relies a little too much on the Night to win games (Kat and Curry can both attest to that), so perhaps my play-style has taken on some changes here.
 
@Endless - I'm not quite a nub like you think I am tbh; it's only really that the forum I have the most games on relies a little too much on the Night to win games (Kat and Curry can both attest to that), so perhaps my play-style has taken on some changes here.
I don't mean to offend, but either way - you feel like your play strength has improved in an aspect you felt like you lacked, and consequently you've suffered from a disproportionate increase in your confidence.

Besides, if you've got less than 20 games under your belt you're still a nub as far as I'm concerned. Then again I'm the resident mafia grampa, so what do I know.

With that, I'm headed to bed to get some well deserved rest. Should be able to fill out the ISO's I didn't complete tomorrow.
 
Not much going on I see.... I'm not home until later. Cleb you did night reads? I thought you were against posting them at night?
 
Just as a heads up we're about to have our meeting then I have one more video to finish for work for the day and then I will be open to read and post, haven't caught up on thread since page 18 (40 posts a page).
 
Not much going on I see.... I'm not home until later. Cleb you did night reads? I thought you were against posting them at night?
I never said I was against Night reads lol.

@Endless - This is just my normal play-style, and it's a lot harsher than people are used to. I've plenty of experience in using it (nearly 50 forum games with this specific style at this point), so I wouldn't call it overconfidence at all.

Also, I took a better look at your reads, and I disagree with Ayaya's reads not being a scum-tell. Not so much for the sheer number of nulls, but for the contradiction which I've already pointed out (not wanting to Town-Lean people for fear that it'll stick all game, but proceeds to Scum-Lean people not thinking the same way). Everything else I can get behind, except maybe Byngo, though we have different reasons for reading him differently.
 
I thought you did in paper Mario, but I can't find it so I guess I imagined it, my bad.

Anyway I will update my reads when I get home in about 5 hours
 
i'm at work right now, but when i get some free time (don't tell my boss), i'll be working on an updated reads list... though my head is spinning from the cluster that was last night lol

just wanted to check in
 
You guys did a fabulous job on getting Qwerty lynched! :D I'm sorry I wasn't here for it and I really wish I was because it seems as though the game started to move really fast!

@ Dolby

I think maybe you think your town leader or something, it looks like your using that "role" by pushing your agenda and telling people to do this and do that. I also don't think you are considering the possibility that you are wrong which is dangerous for town, I hope you consider this more because it could put us in a tight situation. If you change your mind so often I don't see why town should trust you or listen to you as much because changing your vote, opinion and thought process shows little merit in your opinions and theories. That's just an observation of mine right now, please don't be annoyed with me about this.

I'm going to respond to a few posts you have made about me now. :) (Please don't take offence if I come across as rude, as that isn't my intent but when I get defensive I can come across that way so please ignore me.)

Another thing though is that Zendal was so quick to vote for Kirby, yet not Ayaya with pretty much identical reasons.

Kirby had constantly put little effort into the game, I have also never played with Kirby before so I really didn't know what to expect from him. I believe that little effort mixed with inactivity is really fishy and if he had posted more I would never had scum read him in the first place. Ayaya had constantly asked questions and contributed her opinion on matters, her reads list (if you even want to call it that) had little effort in it, yes, but that is only one post out of how many others and I gave her the benefit of the doubt for it, she was tired and was going to bed so I took her word and showed understanding, there were contradictions in it which is something I hated about her read's list,

Zendal voted him over Ayaya almost instantly, and yes he is going to bed, but he didn't even have to choose. He had a clear preference.

At the time of my vote I didn't realize you had made arguments against Ayaya, I would've definitely responded to them if I had.

Zendal insta-voted Kirby, and practically ignored the argument against Ayaya

Ignored them? I didn't notice them Dolby, there's a difference and it seems as though your using this to make your theory more plausible.

Never did make a case on Zendal.

You haven't made a case on me so why should anybody believe anything you say? You haven't went into depth about me at all, most of your posts are you talking about Ayaya but not me. You just add me in because your trying to make another argument against me to get me lynched, I already had heat on me before hand and if you were to try to lynch me before hand for my tone (A laughable reason to lynch someone, btw) it would catch people's attention. So a new argument would be in order, right? You were pushing for an Ayaya lynch and when people didn't do what you told them to do you went on the bandwagon. I have never played with Ayaya before but I can tell that she is a better player than me and if you want her lynched more than me then I think there's a problem, which I will address later in this post.

Also I was inactive during this entire thing, I couldn't defend myself at all which is utterly unfair and it is clear that you took advantage of that to take the role of town leader and share your theory while making jabs at me.

I'm sure there is more posts against me but I really can't reply to all of them as I feel as though that can get a bit repetitive and I'm trying to cut back on that. :)

I know this sounds crazy, especially because Ayaya and Dolby are my strongest town reads but I'm actually considering the fact that they may be a scum team but I don't know why they would want to take me out? Is it because I'm a weaker player and struggle to defend myself or they think I have a blue role? I think I will try to make a case on it later, it's an idea that popped into my head but I don't think it's plausible right now.

Also this whole "if one flips town the other is most likely town" thing had been brought up by Dolby several times, he may have wanted me lynched to "prove" Ayaya is town and faked Ayaya being his most wanted lynch because if I flipped town he would look bad, there is a problem with this theory though. Why would he put himself in that position, I'm doubting it but I'm leaving the possibility out there.


---

Hhh wish Zendel was here, he dropped ofd his Toads suspicion without Toads even saying anything between those two intervals. But Dolby, what do you think he went off of, if not reads? The bandwagon?

I didn't drop my suspicion on him completely, his recent tone became more like the town Toad I know, so I went with my other scum lean, which I wasn't entirely confident with either because him being a reserved person was at the back of my head.

I was considering a no lynch, but a no lynch wouldn't really do anything good for us so I decided to go with what I felt was right. My scum read on Mog was entirely hypothetical so I couldn't vote for her given her explanation and her genuine annoyance with me, and I didn't feel comfortable about voting for Toad because if he flipped town I would be devastated and really annoyed with myself. Kirby seemed like the best option because it was better than nothing, which is what I thought at the time but I clearly didn't share the same opinion with others. :/

-- Side note --

@ Kirby

I'm sorry for scum reading you. :(

I suppose your just a reserved player after all, I would love to see more from you later in the game. :)


-- End of side note --​

I'm a little bugged by Kermit's vote on me, you were town leaning me and it just came out of nowhere, it just isn't sitting right with me. I'm sorry if I missed an explanation on this, reading through so many posts is difficult. :(

Also a big welcome to Abe! I'm so happy to be able to play with you again, I haven't played with you or Karen in a while so I'm excited about this. :blush:

------


If there is any other things I missed during the EOD phase please ask me questions about it! Again I'm sorry for not being here because it was really necessary for me to be present, but I needed my rest. I'm here now so ask away! :blush:



Sorry for any mistakes in this post. :p

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I didn't realize how long this took me! Geez Louise, sorry for the long wait.
 
I said the same thing about Kermits vote too, but their response made sense, check the first few posts of night
 
I didn't even realize I posted that many times @Abe, it contributed to the clutter so I'll try to cut back on that as well. :)

- - - Post Merge - - -

I said the same thing about Kermits vote too, but their response made sense, check the first few posts of night

I must have missed it, I'll try to find it now.

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wow I did not expect that...we got lucky I guess

and @toad yeah I see where you're coming from but here:
I had my vote on mogs and like 15 mins to make a decision without fully reading the thread
I would've kept it on mogs but Dolby kept saying he pushed for zendel/ayaya for 6 hours and blahblahblah
In the case that qwerty flipped town, Dolby would have even more control over future lynches, so I figured my vote would be better off letting Dolby have his way for a day and seeing where he actually stands...and now that qwerty flipped scum, it's also good that Dolby is kept in check

Okay, the reasoning is fair to be honest and I agree.

I'm still keeping an eye on you in case your using this to get away with jumping on the band wagon, I doubt it though luckily for you. :p

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I'll be inactive for a while whilst I'm in the shower, so please excuse.
 
I'm back from the shower and it's still quite.

Are people taking a break?
 
Read the thread up to date so here's a quick read up.

Townie
  • xCleb ? A very pushy and direct player. Asking plenty of questions and not taking **** from anyone. A clear townie
  • Toadworthy ? Believe I misjudged in my original read. Toad is very blatant and direct when questioning people on their choices and voicing their opinions.

Slight Townie

  • Apple2013 - Open when expressing their opinions. Not afraid to ask questions and reasonable.
  • Dolby ? Open when expressing their opinions. Not afraid to ask questions and reasonable. HAS NOT ANSWERED RQS.

Null

  • Uttumori ? Not much post contribution making it difficult to read
  • Mogay ? Similar, not much post contribution as well as her posts presenting neither alignment but a hard to read person etherealness
  • Byngo ? Not much info to go off
  • Endless ? Replaced user, not enough information to give a solid judgement
  • Yzanda ? Not many posts to pose any alignment with
  • Kirbystarship ? Posts are very vague and filler, no effort in read list, accusing me of scum because my posts are ?filler? even though I have a life outside of TBT if I need to make that clear. Is AFK a lot and only returned when discussion for lynching was made. POST #715 ?My role kinda hurts town anyway?. Explanation wanted of this matter.

Slight Scum

  • Zendel ? As brought up in my original read up, Zendell?s tone and manner of speech is a little off to me, making it seem like he is scum and he?s just acting, moreover he had a weird reaction to Ayaya and Kirby

Still need to read:

? Panda
? Kermit
? Curry

Please inform me of anyone I may of missed off and will do my best to do a read up of them
 
Read the thread up to date so here's a quick read up.

Townie
  • xCleb – A very pushy and direct player. Asking plenty of questions and not taking **** from anyone. A clear townie
  • Toadworthy – Believe I misjudged in my original read. Toad is very blatant and direct when questioning people on their choices and voicing their opinions.

Slight Townie

  • Apple2013 - Open when expressing their opinions. Not afraid to ask questions and reasonable.
  • Dolby – Open when expressing their opinions. Not afraid to ask questions and reasonable. HAS NOT ANSWERED RQS.

Null

  • Uttumori – Not much post contribution making it difficult to read
  • Mogay – Similar, not much post contribution as well as her posts presenting neither alignment but a hard to read person etherealness
  • Byngo – Not much info to go off
  • Endless – Replaced user, not enough information to give a solid judgement
  • Yzanda – Not many posts to pose any alignment with
  • Kirbystarship – Posts are very vague and filler, no effort in read list, accusing me of scum because my posts are ‘filler’ even though I have a life outside of TBT if I need to make that clear. Is AFK a lot and only returned when discussion for lynching was made. POST #715 “My role kinda hurts town anyway”. Explanation wanted of this matter.

Slight Scum

  • Zendel – As brought up in my original read up, Zendell’s tone and manner of speech is a little off to me, making it seem like he is scum and he’s just acting, moreover he had a weird reaction to Ayaya and Kirby

Still need to read:

• Panda
• Kermit
• Curry

Please inform me of anyone I may of missed off and will do my best to do a read up of them

Kirby claimed Role blocker though.
 
So I see no reason for you to null him unless you have another explanation.

- - - Post Merge - - -

I'm lost with what's happening with Kirby, could you elaborate?

Kirby claimed he is role blocker, so he is essentially confirmed to be town.
 
So I see no reason for you to null him unless you have another explanation.

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Kirby claimed he is role blocker, so he is essentially confirmed to be town.

I'm keeping him as a null for now until he comes out with more information. There's no reason to believe everything that is said. So unless Kirby comes out with more information, I'm still remaining suspicios as anyone could make that claim just to win people's trust.
 
I'm keeping him as a null for now until he comes out with more information. There's no reason to believe everything that is said. So unless Kirby comes out with more information, I'm still remaining suspicios as anyone could make that claim just to win people's trust.


What makes you think that kirby's claim isn't true?
 
What makes you think that kirby's claim isn't true?

You can't exactly believe everything your told can you? It just makes you out to be gullible and easy to ploy. So again, unless Kirby posts more information out of their own discretion, I will still remain suspicious regardless of what anyone says.
 
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