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Mafia TBT Mafia: Steven Universe 2 Mafia!!! Town and Kat win!!!!

Can someone help me by quoting Trundle's supposed slip?

I said something along the lines of

"The extra kill could have came from strongman or psychopath" and apparently because I thought (and was right) about the role being an extra kill instead of a strengthened kill, I am now scum.
 
Hey guys, I've asked for a replacement. Reason being after crunch work has just really stressed me out, my family starts vacation Friday so I'll be disappearing again starting Friday, and I just don't feel I've been putting in the same amount of effort I would normally like to in a mafia game. Because of these reasons I feel I'm just taking a spot that could be better served with someone who would be more active. This has been an actual quality game in my opinion, I don't want to take away from that by being inactive.
 
Endless

I've finally finished rereading this (at this point) immense thread. Time to leave a town->scum reads list.[->->->->->]

xCleb: In no situation does an unconfident newbie sling this at their mafia partner. (And qwertie, regardless of the fact that they've played before quite a while ago, does fit that description) Otherwise, their (cleb) content hasn't been particularly great and they're in the honeymoon stage of not being terrible anymore, which means they're a little.. overconfident? Not quite the right word, more like an amalgamation of entitled and pretentious, but those words are both too strong.

bri:Wildly obvious competent new town. Many people in the thread draw parallels to amanda's first game, which I think is pretty inaccurate, as amanda had a extremely analytical approach. bri's approach is much more obviously not artificial, and quite a bit harder to fake if bri is actually mafia. (Which I strongly believe is not the case.) Bri's towntells range from her initial reaction upon entering thread, her reaction to ayaya's pressure, and her easily followable logic behind her reads list, regardless of whether I agreed or not. Very impressed with her content as a new player, toboot.

Toads: Rose the roleblocker is back again. I think toads is nothing short of shockingly, blatantly, wildly obvious town. I tend to avoid the use of meta and am an ardent disciple of trying to generate your reads as much from the content of the game as possible, but for some people like toads there's giant meta flags like his town panic that just let you easily pinpoint his alignment. Of course, if he's actually mafia I'd be nothing short of impressed, but that's because it is quite unlikely that he is.

Kirby: Interaction with Qwerty is quite positive, but this green read is more of a "not mafia" read than a "town read". Given Kirby's erratic play, I'd argue that it makes most sense if he was a fool role, but that regardless, lynching him is quite a poor idea.

Dolby: I'm reticent to townread Dolby, as he's quite good at producing genuine content from a red perspective, but in this case I just agree with a lot of his reads, while funnily enough not as much with his reasoning. This is a tenative read at best, and is subject to change. But if Dolby is town he's a solid asset, although not as much as he would be to a mafia team.

SansaiGallade: With regard to your reads, someone being 'rational with decisions' is a demonstration of competence, not a towntell. A towntell is, by nature, something someone wouldn't be able to do - or is unlikely to do - as mafia. Aside from that, your reasoning is fine, and I'm quite fond of your reasoning on Zendel even though I disagree with it's indication of alignment. See, my read on Zendel is that he's someone who presents a fake front as a person, in and out of mafia. The reason I've slotted you in townreads despite arguably bashing most of your reads is because I can see the reasoning behind why you came to them. By all means, you could still be mafia, but I find that scenario considerably less likely than that of you being town.

Byngo: I've gotta admit, prior to ISOing you in prep for writing this, I was incredibly skeptical of the townreads on you. But despite your short posts and brief summeries, a lot of your content is original and quite followable. I especially appreciated your reads list even though you didn't got very in depth to justify your reads.

Zendel: Stop. Posting. I don't mean that as an insult, I don't mean to say your content is particularly bad, because overall you've been quite nice and you have been quite clearly trying to contribute to town. I don't literally mean stop posting all together, I mean ~70 posts in a ~54 hour period is kinda crazy town. Try to post less one liners and make your posts a little more compact. As for why I'm reading him as town, that's due to the nature of the wagon on zendel as day 1 ended, which was nothing short of extremely suspect. I have to admit that I incorrectly had zendel tagged as mafia initially because I thought his play changed just after someone suggested that he played slightly differently as town to immitate the way they suggested, but found out I was incorrect in that case. This is by no means a strong read and is on the weaker end of my town reads.

Panda: Didn't have time to do an ISO, but content reminds me mostly of townpanda, nothing conclusive here. Reasonably weak read. Didn't feel anything opportunistic and I could follow most of the logic she applied, regardless of whether I agreed with it or not.

Yzanda: Yzanda, content is the life of a game of mafia. I realise this game is nothing short of horribly intimidating, but I urge you to try and share your thoughts on who is what based on how people are interacting. If you are town, you needn't worry. New players are pretty obvious town as town once they've started talking.

Apple/Trundle: Not half as much content as regularly, but that's just because he's busy. Important to note that while his reads appear to be on point, that he has quite the bad habit of busing as mafia, so that's not super indicative of his alignment. Looking forward to seeing more of his content after he has more time.

Mogyay: Nothing particularly allignment indicative out of mog yet. I find the alleged cases against her nothing short of horribly weak, and, if required, will dismantle them. That being said, I don't think mogyay's game so far has had any particularly large indications of her being town, so at null she stays.

Heyden: I'm probably being a copout here, but heyden's town game is debilitating enough for town that his mafia play is reasonably difficult to distinguish from it. And I can't conclude anything major from his content, which is mostly air.

Kermit/Karen: Didn't have time to ISO, don't recall anything alignment indicative in her posts at all. That being said, I think all her content is within her playstyle, and that the people pushing her have got quite a bad case.

Uttamori: Floored that anyone has a townread in this direction. They have about 10-15 game related posts, which are 90% air. They've produced 3 townreads, 2 of which are satisfied with a 1 line description, the other of which is the no brainer post-lynch kirby read. I saw some people claim that Utta is fulfilling their meta, but I just absolutely don't buy that when their play would take subzero effort to fake as mafia.

Curry: Only one post of his actually contributes to the game. (well 2, if you count this one. But only one major post) In that post he demostrates a horrific push on Kermit, scumreading her for something both he and I know she would do as town. Arguably, you could put this down to him being super stressed from work and overthinking, so I'm willing to give him plenty of breathing room here and I don't really think pressuring here will have any positive effect at all. Hope you have some more free time soon curry.

Ayaya: Not entirely sure where the townreads were coming from early in the day phase here. Well, maybe I'm being too harsh by saying that. For example: this post is fantastic. It applies an appropriate amount of pressure and progresses the discussion at a sweet pace. It's exactly what I'd have done early in the day phase if I was a player rather than a replacement. That being said, brijade's initial answer was clear and concise. You can argue that this post could be warranted, I wouldn't agree at all, but that's an arguable position, whereas the bri-related content here feels a lot more like ayaya is trying to appear like she is facilitating discussion rather than actually doing it. If I were to use an analogy here it'd be "beating a dead horse", but that wouldn't be quite right, it's more like milking a dry cow.
Lots of people attacked Ayaya's null read list, but while I find it incredibly difficult to comprehend a scenario where you've read all those goddamn pages and not managed to get quite lengthy opinions about most if not all the contributors, a null read list is simply not a scumtell. It will never be a scumtell. In fact, if anything, it would be a towntell, because mafia are more liable to lie and claim to have reads to appear less suspicious. But it isn't anything. Ayaya is possibly mafia, but if she is mafia, it isn't because of the reads list.

Kat: I don't have time to ISO her because there's quite a bit of content, and consequently this read might change when I have the time to go through her posts and re-conclude tomorrow. I think that's more on the unlikely side than the likely side though, as a lot of her posts felt quite off to me, and her play near EoD felt opportunistic.

Fun fact: Endless never made a read on Qwerty even though he was up for lynch alongside Zendel and Ayaya. He did, however, label Zendel as town lean and Ayaya as scum lean. I'm going to note that this is directly opposite of what I thought for the duration of Day 1. I thought Zendel was more likely to be scum and Ayaya was more likely to be town.

Side Note: Endless' read of me mentions the fact that I like to bus my team mates a lot when I'm mafia. This is true, I have done this countless times. However, I think it is pretty conspicuous that he brought this up just before Qwerty flipped.

Weird Reads:
  • He basically supposes xCleb as proven which is kinda strange given that xCleb has more or less only posted about the things in this game that are offbeat or (from my point of view) seem irrelevant.
  • Reads Kat as mafia (Kat is now more or less confirmed third-party) which I can see as being reasonable, other than the fact that his only reasoning for his most mafia read is "some of her posts seemed off to me". If Endless is indeed mafia, he would not have known Kat is third-party (ie he would have assumed her as town) which makes it seem he was trying to draw some naughty town conflict in the game.
  • The vast majority of his town reads have little to no reasoning. I know you were trying to crank these out super fast but where does reasoning come from for Toadsworthy or Panda? Why do they get town reads over some of your null town reads where you have literally almost the exact same reasons for towns vs nulls?

Overall: I am really not sure if Endless is town or not. But he is a scum lean for me. His inconsistency so far and lack of actual content in the game (first three posts were about post spam, then this poorly put together reads list, and then he throws out that I scum slipped and his following 2-3 posts are all just referencing my "scum slip"). If I wasn't being lynched today Endless would be a VERY GOOD OPTION.

Working on more, just posting this now that I have it done.
 
Apple, that is awful

1. On Endless making no Qwerty read. Endless replaced relatively late into Day One, and said reads post was made an full 13 hours after Qwerty was lynched.
2. xCleb isn't proven yes, but unless Qwerty was being actively coached AND strategically inactive, said posts in Endless's reads directed at Cleb make no sense with a scum Cleb
3. Fair on reaction to Kat read... but
4. Most of the time, you don't need to prove that somebody is town unless they're being actively targeted for a lynch. Moreover, while he didn't post a lot for said reads as you purport, then what about his maf reads

All in all, this post ignores the actual situation the post comes under, and misrepresents Endless's logic

Endless could have taken this down himself, but I felt that I should say something here
 
Mogyay Post Analysis

So here's a question: Why was Mog killed? We can probably safely assume at this point it was the mafia unless there's a second vigilante, so here's a post rundown.

RQS:
5. Name the scum team, go.
sensai, zendal, kermit, qwerty and kat based on little to no reasoning

Nothing really notable here - she was right about Qwerty but it was just a random RQS.

dolby raises some interesting points, i never managed to see that post. i'd rather lynch zendal first though.. i think. i know i had zen on scum but i was wrong about him last game at first so i'm kinda conscious of that

Mog saying she'd rather lynch Zendel.

but like zendal is probably town too lbr its town or town

Just as confused about the vote swapping as anyone else was.

Half way through writing this I realized that there is almost no content to go off of. Mogyay never posted solid reads or indicated her alignment significantly in any way, which leads me to believe that this was an attempted blue snipe. This also makes me think Dolby is not mafia :lemon:

- - - Post Merge - - -

Apple, that is awful

1. On Endless making no Qwerty read. Endless replaced relatively late into Day One, and said reads post was made an full 13 hours after Qwerty was lynched.
2. xCleb isn't proven yes, but unless Qwerty was being actively coached AND strategically inactive, said posts in Endless's reads directed at Cleb make no sense with a scum Cleb
3. Fair on reaction to Kat read... but
4. Most of the time, you don't need to prove that somebody is town unless they're being actively targeted for a lynch. Moreover, while he didn't post a lot for said reads as you purport, then what about his maf reads

All in all, this post ignores the actual situation the post comes under, and misrepresents Endless's logic

Endless could have taken this down himself, but I felt that I should say something here

So what do you think of Endless? Do you actually think he's town?
 
So what do you think of Endless? Do you actually think he's town?

He is on a short list of eight people that I had last night who could be scum (only one who died last night was Sensai, who I nulled), but he is a townlean. Though Apple, knowing that the post that you thought was before the Qwerty lynch was after it, does this change your thoughts on Endless at all?
 
Apple, you pointing out that Endless didn't make a read on Qwerty is completely senseless. Endless's reads came after the Night post, so it makes sense that there's no read on Qwerty. It also invalidates your second paragraph, since Qwerty had already flipped by then.

The read on me isn't so much based on the content I've put out, rather the fact that Qwerty brought up me not answering certain RQs (which, many people have brought up at this point). He even states in the same paragraph that my content isn't particularly the best, so what makes you think this is a valid argument to make for this being a "weird read?"

I'm surprised you bring up toads and Panda for the reads that have little reasoning to them, when it seems like his reads on Dolby and Zendel have even less reasoning to them. I feel like there's actually something to go on for the former two, but nothing of real substance to the latter two.

This feels a lot like a shameless OMGUS to try and get away from being lynched Today. I'm even more convinced than I was before now.
 
Apple, you pointing out that Endless didn't make a read on Qwerty is completely senseless. Endless's reads came after the Night post, so it makes sense that there's no read on Qwerty. It also invalidates your second paragraph, since Qwerty had already flipped by then.

The read on me isn't so much based on the content I've put out, rather the fact that Qwerty brought up me not answering certain RQs (which, many people have brought up at this point). He even states in the same paragraph that my content isn't particularly the best, so what makes you think this is a valid argument to make for this being a "weird read?"

I'm surprised you bring up toads and Panda for the reads that have little reasoning to them, when it seems like his reads on Dolby and Zendel have even less reasoning to them. I feel like there's actually something to go on for the former two, but nothing of real substance to the latter two.

This feels a lot like a shameless OMGUS to try and get away from being lynched Today. I'm even more convinced than I was before now.

I was just reading the thread and I swear it was before

- - - Post Merge - - -

He is on a short list of eight people that I had last night who could be scum (only one who died last night was Sensai, who I nulled), but he is a townlean. Though Apple, knowing that the post that you thought was before the Qwerty lynch was after it, does this change your thoughts on Endless at all?

I don't know, I would have to reread it in that order, give me a few

- - - Post Merge - - -

Wow it was like 2 pages after. Well I'm ********

- - - Post Merge - - -

That was like my main scum lean
 
Well anyway I don't blame you guys for wanting to lynch me at this point. I've played terribly so far today and I'm really just distracting town. I'll post a full reads list + what I have in my notepad file before the day ends.
 
Thanks @apple & kirby. After a skim thru of Apple's posts I am not seeing him as scum yet. "You send in kills along with your mafia team." thought the key word is 'along with', idk. I'll do a proper read on trundle later.

@Dolby, were u very sus of Zendal when u were scum leaning Ayaya? I find it interesting that u think her defending Zendal is a reason to scum read her. Didn't u think it's possible that she was just a townie who was trying to defend another player who she thought was town or smtg? I wanna understand ur reasoning. Also whats ur mafia team list now?

Gonna look at uttumori and toads later.
 
Thanks @apple & kirby. After a skim thru of Apple's posts I am not seeing him as scum yet. "You send in kills along with your mafia team." thought the key word is 'along with', idk. I'll do a proper read on trundle later.

@Dolby, were u very sus of Zendal when u were scum leaning Ayaya? I find it interesting that u think her defending Zendal is a reason to scum read her. Didn't u think it's possible that she was just a townie who was trying to defend another player who she thought was town or smtg? I wanna understand ur reasoning. Also whats ur mafia team list now?

Gonna look at uttumori and toads later.

Slight sus, towards the end of night one I was taking what Ayaya was doing as a pocketing attempt. Was far more sus of Ayaya and she was my prefered lynch.

Current maf list is Trundle/Curry/Uttumori after Ayaya(you) inspect and Kat claim. Would guess Panda to fulfill it tbh. And no, at the time I saw it as a pocketing attempt. Read my case on Ayaya though, if you feel like it'd have you get a better feel on me.

- - - Post Merge - - -

Slight sus was on Zendal, realized that I worded it poorly. To clarify, I saw Zendal/Ayaya as scumbuddying rather than pocketing, but was far more suspicious of Ayaya
 
Slight sus, towards the end of night one I was taking what Ayaya was doing as a pocketing attempt. Was far more sus of Ayaya and she was my prefered lynch.

Current maf list is Trundle/Curry/Uttumori after Ayaya(you) inspect and Kat claim. Would guess Panda to fulfill it tbh. And no, at the time I saw it as a pocketing attempt. Read my case on Ayaya though, if you feel like it'd have you get a better feel on me.

- - - Post Merge - - -

Slight sus was on Zendal, realized that I worded it poorly. To clarify, I saw Zendal/Ayaya as scumbuddying rather than pocketing, but was far more suspicious of Ayaya

Thanks for the clear explanation. I did read your case which was why I asked u about it, because I was under the impression that u were scum trying to make ayaya look scummy and pushing for her lynch. But now I definitely understand ur point of view. Putting u on null for now.
 
Sorry for being gone, I went to sleep right after posting my garbage read

I would like to see Uttumori post more. What are your thoughts about the Kat/ Byngo claims?
I kinda want to believe it, theyre either telling the truth or theyre just very smart maf
 
MOD POST:

I'd like to take a moment and remind everyone that mafia is a game. Games are meant to be fun. Getting very antagonistic isn't fun for anyone involved, so please take a break if you feel yourself getting red in the face.
 
Sorry for being gone, I went to sleep right after posting my garbage read

I kinda want to believe it, theyre either telling the truth or theyre just very smart maf

I think they are telling the truth and please try and post more.

I do agree with xCleb about Byngo trying to claim so she doesn't get killed night 2. I could see that as a way to help mafia.
 
Endless



Fun fact: Endless never made a read on Qwerty even though he was up for lynch alongside Zendel and Ayaya. He did, however, label Zendel as town lean and Ayaya as scum lean. I'm going to note that this is directly opposite of what I thought for the duration of Day 1. I thought Zendel was more likely to be scum and Ayaya was more likely to be town.

Side Note: Endless' read of me mentions the fact that I like to bus my team mates a lot when I'm mafia. This is true, I have done this countless times. However, I think it is pretty conspicuous that he brought this up just before Qwerty flipped.

Weird Reads:
  • He basically supposes xCleb as proven which is kinda strange given that xCleb has more or less only posted about the things in this game that are offbeat or (from my point of view) seem irrelevant.
  • Reads Kat as mafia (Kat is now more or less confirmed third-party) which I can see as being reasonable, other than the fact that his only reasoning for his most mafia read is "some of her posts seemed off to me". If Endless is indeed mafia, he would not have known Kat is third-party (ie he would have assumed her as town) which makes it seem he was trying to draw some naughty town conflict in the game.
  • The vast majority of his town reads have little to no reasoning. I know you were trying to crank these out super fast but where does reasoning come from for Toadsworthy or Panda? Why do they get town reads over some of your null town reads where you have literally almost the exact same reasons for towns vs nulls?

Overall: I am really not sure if Endless is town or not. But he is a scum lean for me. His inconsistency so far and lack of actual content in the game (first three posts were about post spam, then this poorly put together reads list, and then he throws out that I scum slipped and his following 2-3 posts are all just referencing my "scum slip"). If I wasn't being lynched today Endless would be a VERY GOOD OPTION.

Working on more, just posting this now that I have it done.

this is so messy... i'm keeping my vote where it is. dolby beat me to everything that i was going to say, w/ this post:
Apple, that is awful

1. On Endless making no Qwerty read. Endless replaced relatively late into Day One, and said reads post was made an full 13 hours after Qwerty was lynched.
2. xCleb isn't proven yes, but unless Qwerty was being actively coached AND strategically inactive, said posts in Endless's reads directed at Cleb make no sense with a scum Cleb
3. Fair on reaction to Kat read... but
4. Most of the time, you don't need to prove that somebody is town unless they're being actively targeted for a lynch. Moreover, while he didn't post a lot for said reads as you purport, then what about his maf reads

All in all, this post ignores the actual situation the post comes under, and misrepresents Endless's logic

Endless could have taken this down himself, but I felt that I should say something here
so i don't feel the need to reiterate. again, i'm not following dolby's lead, he just voiced my exact thoughts before i had the chance.
 
Ok I'm back, with what I can BARELY call a player read...

xCleb-townlean: obvious shift in attitude compared to prev games but I dont think its enough to be concerned about, he seems to be contributing alot so hes a townlean for me

Dolby-town lean, asking valid questions and contributing as usual

Ayaya-null: ive read all the posts she made and I didnt really find anything that stands out besides maybe defending zen a bit much,

Zendel-null: nothing about them really bothers me from what ive seen

Byngo-null: i really have no clue on them.

Toadsworthy-null: nothing sticks out to me

Kirbystarship-null: I dont think i want to believe his claim just yet, for some reason

Brijade07-townlean, her post feel very genuine

Curry-null:nothing stands out to me

Arstotzkan-null: nothing stands out to me from what i see

PandaDarling-null: nothing sticks out to me, but she does lurk alot, I dont think thats enough of a reason for sus though

KermitTea-null: nothing sticks out to me, seems like hes contributing alot recently

Apple2013-null: nothing sticks out to me


Yea i know this read list sucks butt, and im not proud of it at all. I really dont like making player reads, its a weakness of mine. and no i didnt spend this entire time making this list, i got distracted by something else for like an hour or two.

I feel like these reads were kinda rushed IMO. And also did you read KermitTea roleclaim? In the reads you didn't seem to see that she soft claim blue? And after N1 she claim vig and told us who she killed.

- - - Post Merge - - -

Overall I feel like you missed a lot.
 
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