Mafia Noatun, City of Genesis | Bayonetta 2 Mafia | Umbra Witches Win

Aquari · May 8, 2017

That being said, Jacob is who you should go after now, zendel was right about amanda but primarina was a lie, (kinda creative if you ask me), jacob has voted against one of his fellow scum but that was just a cover-up to make him look like hes a townie, once you let your guard down he'll swoop in and kill the rest of you. Yes, prim's behavior has been strange but when you really take a look at jacobs post you'll see why he needs to be killed next, He knows what hes doing and so far succeeded in looking like a townie.

Tensu · May 8, 2017

Uttumori said:
That being said, Jacob is who you should go after now, zendel was right about amanda but primarina was a lie, (kinda creative if you ask me), jacob has voted against one of his fellow scum but that was just a cover-up to make him look like hes a townie, once you let your guard down he'll swoop in and kill the rest of you. Yes, prim's behavior has been strange but when you really take a look at jacobs post you'll see why he needs to be killed next, He knows what hes doing and so far succeeded in looking like a townie.

I honestly don't believe this at all. The way you changed your tune so quickly about Primarina being scum just after you were killed seems extremely suspicious. It only makes sense that you were instructed to lie about this, but the way you are so eager to tell us this is a bit confusing. If you're not being told to lie, can you tell us why you brought Jacob to suspicion now after you were killed? I feel like if you were being honest you wouldn't have ruled him out before.

Aquari · May 8, 2017

Tensu said:
I honestly don't believe this at all. The way you changed your tune so quickly about Primarina being scum just after you were killed seems extremely suspicious. It only makes sense that you were instructed to lie about this, but the way you are so eager to tell us this is a bit confusing. If you're not being told to lie, can you tell us why you brought Jacob to suspicion now after you were killed? I feel like if you were being honest you wouldn't have ruled him out before.

I was wrong about suspecting prim of being scum and since I'm inferno demon, the list of everyone'e role has been handed to me

Tensu · May 8, 2017

Also your point of him "knowing what he's doing" is pretty unsupported? He hasn't really done anything suspicious to suspect him as scum and inactivity isn't enough. You were agreeing with us about Primarina just before, what made you change your mind?

- - - Post Merge - - -

Uttumori said:
I was wrong about suspecting prim of being scum and since I'm inferno demon, the list of everyone'e role has been handed to me

That still doesn't give you freedom to say as you please though. Correct me if I'm wrong but that's irrelevant since you can't say what you want with it.

toadsworthy · May 8, 2017

Uttumori said:
I was wrong about suspecting prim of being scum and since I'm inferno demon, the list of everyone'e role has been handed to me

did you not read my last posts and understand them?
If Jacob and Amanda had voted Primarina in the last day, Primarina would have been voted out, and Mafia would've won.
Jacob did not vote Prim though, he voted Amanda, he basically put the hammer on her... they would've won yesterday if Jacob was scum

Primarina · May 9, 2017

toadsworthy said:
did you not read my last posts and understand them?
If Jacob and Amanda had voted Primarina in the last day, Primarina would have been voted out, and Mafia would've won.
Jacob did not vote Prim though, he voted Amanda, he basically put the hammer on her... they would've won yesterday if Jacob was scum

Think about it, though. Jacob kills Amanda to throw you off, then he gets you to kill me, then there's just you, Tensu, and him, then next night he kills one of you, and he wins.

- - - Post Merge - - -

And Jacob knew Amanda was probably dead anyway, so he tried to save himself by making sure she died to confuse you and keep the pressure on me.

- - - Post Merge - - -

Plus Amanda voted for me, not exactly what one does to their teammate if they want to win the game.

- - - Post Merge - - -

And I know what you're thinking: Well, Amanda might have been doing the same thing you're alleging Jacob did, but the difference is that you were already suspecting both Amanda and I because of Zendel, so it was perfect for Jacob to vote for Amanda because it made him look like town, while Amanda voting for me would confuse you further while keeping suspicion off of Jacob.

- - - Post Merge - - -

Also, if I'd been voted out yesterday you would've had Uttumori, you, and Tensu vs. Amanda and Jacob, and unless I missed something, they wouldn't have won under those circumstances because that wouldn't have been equal town and mafia.

toadsworthy · May 9, 2017

Primarina said:
Also, if I'd been voted out yesterday you would've had Uttumori, you, and Tensu vs. Amanda and Jacob, and unless I missed something, they wouldn't have won under those circumstances because that wouldn't have been equal town and mafia.

but then it goes into night, sages elect a kill... that makes 2 vs 2, mafia wins in the morning

Primarina said:
Plus Amanda voted for me, not exactly what one does to their teammate if they want to win the game.

Here is a recap of the votes from yesterday in order:
Primarina --> Amanda --> Amanda --> Toadsworthy
with Jacob and Amanda left to vote
Amanda is sunk at this point... the only hope for her to stay alive is vote for you, which since you got first vote would lynch you. However Jacob beats her to the punch and votes her even before she can try to save herself. If he was scum and wanted to save Amanda, he very well could have by voting for you, or not voting at all, and amanda finishing it with a vote on you (if they were scum)
Amanda looked at the situation after Jacob's vote and instead in a last ditch effort tried to buff you, but really it was her only move.
I know what you are saying, scum doesn't vote scum... but in this case, amanda had no other option, was dead in the water, and tried to buff you so that now you have the opportunity to come in here and say exactly that "scum doesn't vote scum." but i don't buy it, and this explanation makes more sense than Jacob and Amanda concocting some plan to kill everyone the next day, when they could've won it last night....

- - - Post Merge - - -

I mean i guess they could've voted for me in that situation, but you would've been an easier target

Nightmares · May 9, 2017

Tensu said:
I honestly don't believe this at all. The way you changed your tune so quickly about Primarina being scum just after you were killed seems extremely suspicious. It only makes sense that you were instructed to lie about this, but the way you are so eager to tell us this is a bit confusing. If you're not being told to lie, can you tell us why you brought Jacob to suspicion now after you were killed? I feel like if you were being honest you wouldn't have ruled him out before.

Yeah, Uttumori could have been "instructed to lie" but she didn't have to
Like Mori said, the role's been given to her, so...imo... it doesn't seem that crazy that she'd change her opinion

moonford · May 9, 2017

1. Bowie cannot lie to me about whose Scum and whose not.
2. Jacob was in the game at that point so he would've been listed.
3. I was instructed to tell the truth and only the truth, not lie for one and tell the truth for another.
This role doesn't work like that.
4. You can opt out of this role so it's kinda sickening that Uttumori would lie like this.

The only explanation I can think of is that Bowie changed Jacob's role after he gave me my Pm.

Which again is unfair and not likely on Bowie's part.

There's also the fact that Jacob put the hammer down on possibly the strongest and most useful sage, Amanda, Amanda already voted Primarina and so did Toad so it would've been better to get rid of the less experienced sage, right? + Primarina was the most suspicious at the time. Another reason why Jacob isn't a sage. This is what Toads has been saying, listen to him please.

toadsworthy · May 9, 2017

Instead of hypothesizing whether the info is real or fake, which is literally a guess. Go back and read the posts, like mafia is supposed to be played, and determine who is mafia that way

- - - Post Merge - - -

Primarina just voted Jacob without posting in here at all....

amanda1983 · May 9, 2017

Zendel said:
I will be peeved if you guys vote Jacob after all this information that has been given to you.

Plus Amanda and Nightmares haven't posted anything since they became Infernos, because they both know that they've lost.

No mate, I haven't been posting due to my health and a hospital visit. I'll be fine, but unfortunately my real life has drastically limited my ability to participate the past little while.

- - - Post Merge - - -

Tensu said:
Also your point of him "knowing what he's doing" is pretty unsupported? He hasn't really done anything suspicious to suspect him as scum and inactivity isn't enough. You were agreeing with us about Primarina just before, what made you change your mind?

- - - Post Merge - - -

That still doesn't give you freedom to say as you please though. Correct me if I'm wrong but that's irrelevant since you can't say what you want with it.

Jacob knows how to player Mafia extremely well - he was my coach in my first game. Best not to ever underestimate him.

moonford · May 9, 2017

amanda1983 said:
No mate, I haven't been posting due to my health and a hospital visit. I'll be fine, but unfortunately my real life has drastically limited my ability to participate the past little while.

- - - Post Merge - - -

Jacob knows how to player Mafia extremely well - he was my coach in my first game. Best not to ever underestimate him.

I see, sorry about that. I hope things look up for you and I'm sorry for assuming.

amanda1983 · May 9, 2017

toadsworthy said:
did you not read my last posts and understand them?
If Jacob and Amanda had voted Primarina in the last day, Primarina would have been voted out, and Mafia would've won.
Jacob did not vote Prim though, he voted Amanda, he basically put the hammer on her... they would've won yesterday if Jacob was scum

Please check the OP again - sages win when they *outnumber* witches in this game. NOT equal, as in a standard mafia game. Y'all need to be looking at our motives, votes, and words in light of our actual win condition.

We needed to ensure we kept you guys unaware of our true numbers as long as possible in order to pull of the win. Rather tough in a set-up that allows talking dead players with the role list lol, but we made the best of it.

And the game isn't over yet by any stretch.

- - - Post Merge - - -

Ahhh oops I just realised I may not be allowed to talk now, as it's day. I knew not to talk about which role the particular player I've chosen has until night, but didn't twig that I'm *only* supposed to be active and posting at night until just now.

So. Uh. I'm really sorry. I'll stop posting now.

toadsworthy · May 9, 2017

amanda1983 said:
Please check the OP again - sages win when they *outnumber* witches in this game. NOT equal, as in a standard mafia game. Y'all need to be looking at our motives, votes, and words in light of our actual win condition.

We needed to ensure we kept you guys unaware of our true numbers as long as possible in order to pull of the win. Rather tough in a set-up that allows talking dead players with the role list lol, but we made the best of it.

And the game isn't over yet by any stretch.

- - - Post Merge - - -

Ahhh oops I just realised I may not be allowed to talk now, as it's day. I knew not to talk about which role the particular player I've chosen has until night, but didn't twig that I'm *only* supposed to be active and posting at night until just now.

So. Uh. I'm really sorry. I'll stop posting now.

ok, well if I was wrong... why would you correct me? wouldn't you just let me keep being wrong for your benefit, then we could keep voting primarina and then lose?

The fact a mafian is putting in effort at all right now shows me they want to change something... so they see my vote on Primarina and don't want others to do it too.

also where is Jacob.....

amanda1983 · May 9, 2017

toadsworthy said:
ok, well if I was wrong... why would you correct me? wouldn't you just let me keep being wrong for your benefit, then we could keep voting primarina and then lose?

The fact a mafian is putting in effort at all right now shows me they want to change something... so they see my vote on Primarina and don't want others to do it too.

also where is Jacob.....

Dude my win condition changed now that I'm an Infernal Demon - that's a new role. What I did as mafia has nothing to do with what I do now. Just FYI.

(I'm not going to post anything to influence the game until Bowie confirms if I'm allowed to post during the day or not, but this seems too important a to leave uncorrected for you right now.)

toadsworthy · May 9, 2017

amanda1983 said:
Dude my win condition changed now that I'm an Infernal Demon - that's a new role. What I did as mafia has nothing to do with what I do now. Just FYI.

(I'm not going to post anything to influence the game until Bowie confirms if I'm allowed to post during the day or not, but this seems too important a to leave uncorrected for you right now.)

Well numbers aside, if Jacob and amanda were on a team together they could've saved Amanda from being lynched that day and together voted to kill Primarina, which would've left them at 2 vs 2 which is a much better position than trying to pull together a mega-buff to keep Jacob safe. Primarina would've come up town and then they could've easily dumped all the blame and shade and sus onto me having led that lynch... thats a much safer, easier plan than the two of them trying to mega-buff, pull together some elaborate plan

Bowie in a past post told us "everything we needed to know about the Infernal Demons" and it didn't include new role or win-cons

so i don't care what your new role is

... my vote is cast and I feel confident about it, if you really did make up this elaborate plan, kudos, but I just don't logically see it
but I do hope you are feeling better

sorry you had to go through that

amanda1983 · May 9, 2017

toadsworthy said:
Well numbers aside, if Jacob and amanda were on a team together they could've saved Amanda from being lynched that day and together voted to kill Primarina, which would've left them at 2 vs 2 which is a much better position than trying to pull together a mega-buff to keep Jacob safe. Primarina would've come up town and then they could've easily dumped all the blame and shade and sus onto me having led that lynch... thats a much safer, easier plan than the two of them trying to mega-buff, pull together some elaborate plan

Bowie in a past post told us "everything we needed to know about the Infernal Demons" and it didn't include new role or win-cons

so i don't care what your new role is ... my vote is cast and I feel confident about it, if you really did make up this elaborate plan, kudos, but I just don't logically see it
but I do hope you are feeling better sorry you had to go through that

From Bowie in the OP :

The first role is Umbra Witch, the second role is Lumen Sage, and the third role is an unforgiven surprise, which will be unveiled at a later point in the game as one of many surprise elements.

The win-con has to change for the role given the details of it. Think about it : a Town player dies and is converted to an Infernal Demon and told they have to lie. If they do, they are now playing against their win-con *unless* the new role comes with a new win-con. What that win-con is, is a part of the mystery.

But I'm not telling you this to try and influence you or any other player. I'm explaining the mechanics of my role as there is a lot of confusion about it. I don't care what you make of the info, or if you believe me or not. Bowie will be along to set things straight as soon as they can, I'm just clarifying for my part since I saw things being attributed to me that were just not accurate.

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Also, thanks. It's been a kind of hell, but things are looking up. Slowly, but progress is progress!

Jacob · May 9, 2017

In school currently, can't type for too long until I get home!!

Lets not forget: I am a replacement not a normal player, Bowie posted that I am replacing N e s s. Call it a mistake or a fluke, or maybe I'm not understanding, but N e s s's role was given out already. Call me what you want but you can't call me scum!!

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In school currently, can't type for too long until I get home!!

Lets not forget: I am a replacement, not a normal player. Bowie posted that I am replacing N e s s due to inactivity? Call it a mistake or a fluke, or maybe I'm not understanding, but N e s s's (and, in turn, my) role was given out already.

- - - Post Merge - - -

I can try to explain better later, sorry

- - - Post Merge - - -

oh i love these glitches

Bowie · May 9, 2017

Hi, folks! Here to settle the chaos now.

First of all, I'm sorry about your health, Amanda. I hope you get better soon! You are perfectly fine to post provided you keep your information-sharing to Night phase(s).

Okay, so, Infernal Demons do not have a unique win condition or a lose condition. Regardless of whether they have been told to lie or to tell the truth, their win condition remains the same from when they died. So, if a Sage ends up as one, then they still class as a Sage (even though they do not have any of the same actions as an alive Sage).

Jacob said:
but N e s s's (and, in turn, my) role was given out already.

Your role was unveiled because you were assigned as Rosa (which, to jog everyone's memory, protects you for a Day and Night), and only Witches have a chance of getting that role.

toadsworthy · May 9, 2017

Bowie said:
Hi, folks! Here to settle the chaos now.

First of all, I'm sorry about your health, Amanda. I hope you get better soon! You are perfectly fine to post provided you keep your information-sharing to Night phase(s).

Okay, so, Infernal Demons do not have a unique win condition or a lose condition. Regardless of whether they have been told to lie or to tell the truth, their win condition remains the same from when they died. So, if a Sage ends up as one, then they still class as a Sage (even though they do not have any of the same actions as an alive Sage).

Your role was unveiled because you were assigned as Rosa (which, to jog everyone's memory, protects you for a Day and Night), and only Witches have a chance of getting that role.

Well then if anyone else votes Jacob, you are an idiot

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