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Feminism Discussion Thread

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Look pillow bunny, I like a lot of things that follow under the stereotype of being "boy things". However, I identify as the gender given to me at birth which is female.
Saying what you're saying, is dismissing the experiences a lot of people within the trans community have faced. Just because someone who is a transwoman, likes shopping, makeup and stereotypical "girl things" does not mean their hobbies are the reason they've transitioned or the reason they identify as a woman.

so do i. i like "male" and "female" things, not because i'm transwhatever, but because i'm a human and have a personality.

i think it's not more "i fit into x stereotype more than y stereotype", but "i don't fit into x stereotype". there are women today who live in extremely sexist areas, and know that they are more than their gender stereotype, so they tell themselves they are trans as a coping mechanism. because they feel they are a human, and people of thier gender are stereotyped so much they do not seem to be humans.

the whole "not supporting trans people is evil" idea is just... wrong, because it's the only way to move away from gender roles.

sorry for using the transracial metaphor so much, but let's say instead of promoting the idea that black and white people were completely equal, society said that "blacks and whites are different, though neither is better or worse". black people with stereotypical "white" traits (desire for success, intelligence, etc.) would be "transwhite", white people with stereotypical "black" traits would be "transblack". yes, this would be excellent for designated black at birth(?) people during the early days of pseudoequality, but not for the long term. racial stereotypes against black people would be alive and well, perhaps even more so than they were in the past.
 
transracial = i like this culture and the stereotypes associated with it. i am a now member of this culture.
transgender = i like this gender and the stereotypes associated with it. i am a now member of this gender.

there is no "state of being female". decisions that someone is transgender are based SOLELY on stereotypes, because all biological sex differences (if any) are extremely minor and. people who identify as trans associate themselves with the STEREOTYPES aimed at the other sex (eg. people who identify as transwomen because they like shopping, or people who identify as transmen because they like sports). if these stereotypes ("genders") did not exist, people would now have to modify their bodies to act like themselves.

gender is a social construct that should be done away with, rather than reinforced.

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except it's not

there's little girls who think they must be boys because they don't want to play with dolls. they don't have a godlike understanding of the universe and the origins of gender -- they just believe it because they are being told that a boy is someone who likes sports, and a girl is someone who likes dolls. even teenagers and adults have trouble breaking away from these roles because they are so deeply ingrained in our culture and society.

yes, transitioning keeps them from depression, but they would not have depression in the first place if gender roles did not exist.

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they suffer from dysphoria due to gender roles, even if they don't realize it

wtf are u even trying to say??? ok so 1. don't talk as if you know what trans people are going through if you're cis. 2. gender does exist and even though it maybe would be better if it didn't, it does.

i, as a trans person, am pretty sure that most people who identify as trans do not do so because they like things that society says that another gender likes.
like. that doesn't really happen.

do we need to get away from gender roles and start telling people that it is okay to be whoever they are no matter how they dress, what they do, and what they like? hell ye!! should gender have to have so much impact on our lives as it has?? heck no!!! should gender exist?? yEAh.
gender is a social construct, but it is one that we have lived with for so long. and people feel connected to it!! and that's totally alright. gender should be allowed to exist, but gender should also never be forced upon anybody. to many trans people their gender(s)/nongender is very important, and that should be respected. many cis people like their gender too :>

and??? the transracial thing??? ok so gender is a social construct but race is not. race is something you are born with, it's in your blood and stuff
gender is not. easy!!!
 
That's not gender dysmorphia, then. I'm talking about people who experience real gender dysmorphia because they feel they should be one gender but are the opposite. It has nothing to do with 'boys do this, girls do this', it's about what their body is like, and not having gender roles wouldn't change the fact that their biological sex doesn't match up with the sex they feel they should be, not because they like basket ball instead of dolls, but because they feel wrong in their current body.



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Please, tell me more about how you know more about gender dysmorphia than someone who's actually experienced it.

they feel wrong in their current bodies because they are being told that what they are doing is wrong for a person with their body, therefore they must have been born in the wrong body.

you have offered no alternative theory.

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wtf are u even trying to say??? ok so 1. don't talk as if you know what trans people are going through if you're cis. 2. gender does exist and even though it maybe would be better if it didn't, it does.

i, as a trans person, am pretty sure that most people who identify as trans do not do so because they like things that society says that another gender likes.
like. that doesn't really happen.

do we need to get away from gender roles and start telling people that it is okay to be whoever they are no matter how they dress, what they do, and what they like? hell ye!! should gender have to have so much impact on our lives as it has?? heck no!!! should gender exist?? yEAh.
gender is a social construct, but it is one that we have lived with for so long. and people feel connected to it!! and that's totally alright. gender should be allowed to exist, but gender should also never be forced upon anybody. to many trans people their gender(s)/nongender is very important, and that should be respected. many cis people like their gender too :>

and??? the transracial thing??? ok so gender is a social construct but race is not. race is something you are born with, it's in your blood and stuff
gender is not. easy!!!

gender is wrong and harming society. we should not keep it because of "tradition". should we also keep ableism, sexism, and racism because they are a part of our society?

racial stereotypes are a social construct. biological sex and race are both something you are born with and cannot change, but should have no effect on your life.

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brb walking my dog
 
Okay I think we should maybe steer away from this discussion since pillow is not going to change their stance.
 
The main point I've been trying to make is
MEN
-equality-
WOMEN​

Women are the ones who are IN GENERAL treated as inferior, in order to achieve equality, women need more rights and respect (not just USA) - men don't need as much work and help as the women do. Im not saying men shouldn't be respected. If you don't get it reAd my message again. They don't need it /as much/. They're already the people on top of the leaderboard. The issues men face are real and I accept that - however those issues aren't showing men as inferior to women.
I am not saying men don't struggle. They do. Just not as much. Feminism addresses that as well, my issue is with people who won't admit that women are globally suffering more and they try to say "men have it just as bad, get over it." Men aren't being forced to marry at age 10. They're allowed to keep their possessions and vote everywhere across the world. They can get away with rape if a woman doesn't have five witnesses.

I'm going to keep repeating this: I know men have issues too, I know. I k-n-o-w. That isn't my point.
 
so do i. i like "male" and "female" things, not because i'm transwhatever, but because i'm a human and have a personality.

i think it's not more "i fit into x stereotype more than y stereotype", but "i don't fit into x stereotype". there are women today who live in extremely sexist areas, and know that they are more than their gender stereotype, so they tell themselves they are trans as a coping mechanism. because they feel they are a human, and people of thier gender are stereotyped so much they do not seem to be humans.

the whole "not supporting trans people is evil" idea is just... wrong, because it's the only way to move away from gender roles.

sorry for using the transracial metaphor so much, but let's say instead of promoting the idea that black and white people were completely equal, society said that "blacks and whites are different, though neither is better or worse". black people with stereotypical "white" traits (desire for success, intelligence, etc.) would be "transwhite", white people with stereotypical "black" traits would be "transblack". yes, this would be excellent for designated black at birth(?) people during the early days of pseudoequality, but not for the long term. racial stereotypes against black people would be alive and well, perhaps even more so than they were in the past.

please don't say "transwhatever"


AGAIN, people do not transition because of stereotypes. Please educate yourself on the trans community a little more, as saying what you're saying is incredibly insensitive and is dismissing the real experiences members of the community have faced. Chalking it up to something so, simplistic is incredibly disrespectful.

I don't understand why you're bringing racism up. That is a whole different playing field, but since we're here:
All these "good" or rather "white" qualities you're listing derive from institutionalized racism and will NEVER EQUATE to the experiences members of trans community face when feeling dysmorphic within their bodies. You are trying to compare apples and oranges, and frankly I find this incredibly rude.
May not be your intention, but I'm just letting you know your constant dismissal of the very real experiences minorities in this world face is not appreciated at all.
 
The movement was not discredited by feminists. It was discredited by those outside the movement. Those who opposed feminism are the reason it's seen negatively and has negative connotations. This is not unique to feminism. Every social equality movement has/is facing this. The easiest way to fight against social equality is to make it look like it isn't about equality. It's always happened, and always will happen.
 
wow WTF why did a post of mine get removed? and I didn't even get a warning or anything telling me it was removed what the hell? please whoever removed the post explain to me why?​

Message the staff if you have questions about post removal, warnings etc. It's not a good idea to post in thread when something like that happens
 
they feel wrong in their current bodies because they are being told that what they are doing is wrong for a person with their body, therefore they must have been born in the wrong body.

you have offered no alternative theory.

They feel wrong in their current bodies because they feel wrong in them. It has nothing to do with what they're being told, just that their body feels wrong.

And unless you've experienced gender dysmorphia before, and I'm betting all my money that you didn't, neither you or I have any say in what a transgender person should or shouldn't do with their body. And that's all I'm gonna say on this topic.
 
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The movement was not discredited by feminists. It was discredited by those outside the movement. Those who opposed feminism are the reason it's seen negatively and has negative connotations. This is not unique to feminism. Every social equality movement has/is facing this. The easiest way to fight against social equality is to make it look like it isn't about equality. It's always happened, and always will happen.

I disagree. There are definitely people that claim to be Feminists who are extremists that discredit the movement, and are "inside".

The same goes for other major groups such as religion or politics.

For instance there are radical Christians that are inside the movement that discredit it, as well as Muslims and other religions.

When it comes to politics there are always radicals as well who are seen as inside the movement but tarnish the name of a party or a political stance etc.
 
Message the staff if you have questions about post removal, warnings etc. It's not a good idea to post in thread when something like that happens

ah okay I edited my post :'3 my bad

also what's the current status of this thread? is it still going smoothly
or did it just go into a downward spiral?​
 
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The movement was not discredited by feminists. It was discredited by those outside the movement. Those who opposed feminism are the reason it's seen negatively and has negative connotations. This is not unique to feminism. Every social equality movement has/is facing this. The easiest way to fight against social equality is to make it look like it isn't about equality. It's always happened, and always will happen.

You nailed it right on the head.
Age old tactic to shift the attention away from the issue.

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I disagree. There are definitely people that claim to be Feminists who are extremists that discredit the movement, and are "inside".

The same goes for other major groups such as religion or politics.

For instance there are radical Christians that are inside the movement that discredit it, as well as Muslims and other religions.

When it comes to politics there are always radicals as well who are seen as inside the movement but tarnish the name of a party or a political stance etc.

But there are extremists in every group, and we all acknowledge that. So why do we only give attention to those individuals?
 
You nailed it right on the head.
Age old tactic to shift the attention away from the issue.

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But there are extremists in every group, and we all acknowledge that. So why do we only give attention to those individuals?

I don't know. Like I said in an earlier post is that negativity seems to always get more attention than positivity, especially in the media.
 
please don't say "transwhatever"


AGAIN, people do not transition because of stereotypes. Please educate yourself on the trans community a little more, as saying what you're saying is incredibly insensitive and is dismissing the real experiences members of the community have faced. Chalking it up to something so, simplistic is incredibly disrespectful.

I don't understand why you're bringing racism up. That is a whole different playing field, but since we're here:
All these "good" or rather "white" qualities you're listing derive from institutionalized racism and will NEVER EQUATE to the experiences members of trans community face when feeling dysmorphic within their bodies. You are trying to compare apples and oranges, and frankly I find this incredibly rude.
May not be your intention, but I'm just letting you know your constant dismissal of the very real experiences minorities in this world face is not appreciated at all.

all gender roles derive from institutionalized sexism

what are these real experiences? "i am a woman because i am"? how do you define woman?????
 
I don't know. Like I said in an earlier post is that negativity seems to always get more attention than positivity, especially in the media.

But isn't it interesting that extremists in groups that benefit the most privileged within society are dismissed as just radicals and are't given the most attention?
 
You nailed it right on the head.
Age old tactic to shift the attention away from the issue.

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But there are extremists in every group, and we all acknowledge that. So why do we only give attention to those individuals?

because they are the vocal minority
 
all gender roles derive from institutionalized sexism

what are these real experiences? "i am a woman because i am"? how do you define woman?????

no one's denying institutionalized sexism exist, what's your point?

Identifying as a specific gender derives from something a lot deeper than gender roles. It has a lot to do with sex, which is biological. A woman is anyone who identifies as a woman. A man is anyone who identifies as a man.

Now, I'm going to ask you, if you're so sure that if gender roles were abolished there would be less transpeople. Then what about people who are intersex? What happens to them in your idea?
 
They feel wrong in their current bodies because they feel wrong in them. It has nothing to do with what they're being told, just that their body feels wrong.

And unless you've experienced gender dysmorphia before, and I'm betting all my money that you didn't, neither you or I have any say in what a transgender person should or shouldn't do with their body. And that's all I'm gonna say on this topic.

wow, literally :(

i know people who thought they might be trans until they realized the very stuff i'm talking about now
 
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