Mafia TBT Mafia XV: The Siren's Call (Game Over/Mafia & Third Party Win!)

Lauren said:

i assume they cannot protect two nights in a row, from my own deduction, doctors would have protected someone they felt mafia would go for, I have my ideas on who. These people might also if not vet have a blue role of importance, then what? we lose them due to them being vulnerable

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You don't get it. They are still vulnerable whether or not they claim. How does claiming they were hit make them more vulnerable? Scum already knew they were hit, and that hitting them second night will likely kill them.

Now if they claimed, it gives the opportunity for a second doctor to protect them. Or it lets a watcher know that that person should be watched that night. This is all highly valuable information to town, that scum can't punish.

Lauren said:

I understand what you're saying I dont feel its necessary for people to say they were hit this early.

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We've spent how many posts this game debating why there is only one kill, and you don't feel it's necessary for people to say they were hit?

no i dont, if im honest. I'd say wait and see how night 1 pans out.

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Clearly they dont think so either because no one has spoken out yet either!

Jeremy said:

Do role blocks in this game block kills?

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Revised

Do role blocks in this game block MAFIA kills?

I hope for the sake of town then that it's because nobody was hit or saves are not notified. If people really don't think it's good play to claim a hit then we're ****ed.

At this stage, my top town reads are minties, dad and Lauren. Minties and dad because they're trying to figure this game out, and Lauren because no sane mafia would argue for such an anti-town play.

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oath2order said:

Revised

Do role blocks in this game block MAFIA kills?

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Revised

Do role blocks in this game block FACTIONAL kills?

I highly doubt we'll get an answer. Even if Tina was planning on answering, the amount of chaos it's causing and also the fact that a lynch may be decided by the answer, means she won't now.

It's not anti town play? But either way I'm not arguing about it anymore.

Can you name me one game where not claiming hits was good town play? This is a no PM game, which means all the information we as town have is in this thread. There's no secret network of blues that are coordinating their actions. If people truly think that staying quiet when they are hit is the correct play, then lynch me now because I'm done with this game.

KarlaKGB said:

What is a coincidence, that ryan roleblocked me on the same night that there were fewer kills than expected?

I read ryan as town, dumb town, but town nonetheless. He's a bad lynch and should not be considered. I don't want to mislynched someone who mafia were going to hit anyway.

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We need to get off the idea that a roleblocker can stop factional kills. The likelihood of that happening is the same as doctor saves or veterans not being notified, yet nobody has considered those possibilities.

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I also don't understand why he waited this long to say this. I'm skeptical.

Fine ok then, if you were hit last night come out and tell us. Where you protected or are you a veteran!

Lauren said:

Fine ok then, if you were hit last night come out and tell us. Where you protected or are you a veteran!

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Do you even read? I don't want people to claim if they were protected or a veteran. I just want people to claim if they were hit.

You know, I liked my question how it was.

KarlaKGB said:

Do you even read? I don't want people to claim if they were protected or a veteran. I just want people to claim if they were hit.

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Another possibility is that there is a kill-immune role. This seems unlikely though as it would be overpowered.

Cory said:

I also don't understand why he waited this long to say this. I'm skeptical.

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Well probably because he recognised that claiming town roleblocker is a stupid move, but he felt confident and desperate enough that I was scum, that he came out with it.

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Mafia is a game of information. It's a game of the uninformed majority vs the informed minority. The only advantage scum has over town is knowledge. As the game progresses, and there are votelists and flips to look at, mafia begins to lose the information advantage. Therefore, any move that close the information gap between town and mafia is good.


Now let's look at that roleplay I posted again.

Me: "Hey guys, I took a hit during the night"

Ok, what information does town get from this?
That I was hit.
That I was either protected, or I am a veteran.
That is literally all you can deduce from that. You don't know if I'm a VT, or veteran, or other blue, or even scum.

Ok, what information Mafia deduce from that?
That I was hit.
That I was either protected, or I am a veteran.
But the important thing here is, before I claimed, Mafia already knew that I was hit. They had this information that town did not. By giving town information that Mafia already has, I am closing the information gap. I haven't given Mafia any more information.
Note that I did not say to claim your role. I only said to claim that you took a hit. This is because Mafia don't know why you didn't die, and you should keep them in the dark about that.

In a no PM game, it is near impossible to give information only to town. But that's fine, because as town you only need to equalise the information disparity between the two teams in order to win. Town's advantage is in its numerical superiority.

I recognise that if there was a serial killer, then yes, Mafia would not have already known I was hit. This is a small exception and it should not detract from the overall strategy of town. If you get caught up in the tiny 'what-ifs', you won't get anywhere. Make the play that makes sense under most situations. It's like a messed up Occam's razor, but the concept is still good.

KarlaKGB said:

Do role blocks in this game block FACTIONAL kills?

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No. Factional kills cannot be blocked.

Tina said:

No. Factional kills cannot be blocked.

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Well holy **** can we get off my ass now please.

What's a factional kill? A mafia or cult kill (excluding vig and sk)?

I have always treated factional kills as being a kill that is inherent to your faction. This means Mafia KP, and also serial killer's kill powers. Vigilantes are not factional, because their faction is town, which does not have an inherent kill. That's not to say it's how it works this game.

Tina said:

No. Factional kills cannot be blocked.

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KarlaKGB said:

I have always treated factional kills as being a kill that is inherent to your faction. This means Mafia KP, and also serial killer's kill powers. Vigilantes are not factional, because their faction is town, which does not have an inherent kill. That's not to say it's how it works this game.

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Well since it's apparently up for interpretation:

What is the definition of a factional kill for this game?

Ugh Ryan you outed yourself for no reason.

Superpenguin, your quiet little unvote isn't unnoticed. I expected you to know better than to just accept that factional kills could be blocked. Your eagerness to lynch me, plus the terrible reason (that awful post about lynching me because you don't want to hear my laughter) is so very scummy. I haven't forgotten how you also advocated for no lynching.

You're second on my scumlist.